Post by: RobD on August 15, 2013, 04:57:43 PM
yer thoughts and opinions please, gents?
Post by: R.M. on August 15, 2013, 05:04:43 PM
Post by: RobD on August 15, 2013, 05:12:00 PM
Post by: david32cal on August 15, 2013, 07:05:33 PM
Post by: RobD on August 15, 2013, 07:12:28 PM
Quote from: "david32cal"
yep! .32 is what i would go with.
"david32cal" - i would never have guessed you'd vote for a .32! :rotf
Post by: RobD on August 15, 2013, 07:21:45 PM
or go longer or shorter?
Post by: david32cal on August 15, 2013, 11:19:45 PM
Post by: david32cal on August 15, 2013, 11:21:48 PM
Quote from: "rfd"
Quote from: "david32cal"yep! .32 is what i would go with.
"david32cal" - i would never have guessed you'd vote for a .32! :rotf
the .32 is the perfect caliber for squirrels IMO
Post by: RobD on August 16, 2013, 05:46:27 AM
will go with tip's carolina for the full stock - but what wood? good ol' standby maple? or maybe walnut? or ...... ?
this is fun!
Post by: Captchee on August 16, 2013, 07:59:05 AM
(http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y242/captchee/Rifles/DSC00921.jpg)
(http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y242/captchee/Rifles/DSC00919.jpg)
(http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y242/captchee/Rifles/DSC00914.jpg)
(http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y242/captchee/Rifles/DSC00913.jpg)
(http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y242/captchee/Rifles/DSC00905.jpg)
(http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y242/captchee/Rifles/DSC00906.jpg)
Post by: gunmaker on August 16, 2013, 11:36:07 AM
(http://i1283.photobucket.com/albums/a555/TomKnight43/32%20cal%20Indiana%20flint%20rifle/th_P1000720_zps1ec69c08.jpg) (http://http)
Post by: Two Steps on August 16, 2013, 01:01:59 PM
Al
Post by: cayres1955 on August 16, 2013, 04:10:31 PM
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Post by: Buzzard on August 16, 2013, 04:31:41 PM
Post by: RobD on August 16, 2013, 04:38:07 PM
Quote from: "Buzzard"
From the looks of this, i'll just take my 36cal and go back to the woods. The 36cal is a most superior caliber for all small game for more reasons than i have time to start an argument about. That's why my 32 SMR is for sale.
why do you prefer 36 over 32 or 40, or even 45?
Post by: RobD on August 16, 2013, 04:39:48 PM
Post by: sse on August 16, 2013, 04:49:33 PM
Post by: Riley/MN on August 16, 2013, 05:44:20 PM
Quote from: "sse"
Any squirrel would be 'honored' to go in the stew-pot after takin a hit from Cap's rifle...LOL
They jump out on the limb and say "Take me, Bill Tyler, take me!"
Post by: Captchee on August 16, 2013, 06:01:12 PM
Quote from: "rfd"
cap, that's a drop-dead beauty! caliber and barrel length, please?
its my rendition of a J baum rifle , which was originally a 40 cal smoothbore . but it assumed that it probably was rifled prior .
She is a 36 cal ,44 inch Octagon to round barrel goes from 8 to 16 flats to round , no wedding band transition .
I also chose to French grey the barrel so as to bring out the engraving more
The stock is of black walnut .
The rifle is mounted in silver , from my own castings or where needed formed . IE nose cap , TG butt plate , side plate
Lock is a DE London , which I also built from castings .
Barrel engraving you see in the photos has been relieved . The breech bands are 18 ct gold . Front sight has a German silver blade. Its base is 4 leaves which clasp the sight this I formed from 14ct gold .
The wrist checkering is accented with 99.9% silver
Post by: 2 Locks on August 16, 2013, 08:53:53 PM
Post by: bluebottle on August 17, 2013, 06:32:52 AM
Post by: RobD on August 17, 2013, 07:13:30 AM
your thoughts on stock wood for a 32 squirrel rifle, 42" barrel ... ?
Post by: Captchee on August 17, 2013, 07:46:01 AM
Quote from: "rfd"
cap's got an awesome rifle there, no doubt. but can we get back to the topic, please?
your thoughts on stock wood for a 32 squirrel rifle, 42" barrel ... ?
My post wasn’t to lead this topic off . But to say , that IMO the answer to your question is one of personal preference of what your actually wanting OR recreating a specific rifle from the past .
I don’t own the rifle I posted , I built it for a customer . The lady shoots it all the time . I finished it up in February of this year and I would bet she has a good 1000 rounds through it now .
So if you look through the posts on this thread you will see that most have different ideas of what they want . Some like cal . In 32 others in 36 . Some like flintlocks , others cap . Some want a full stock , others a ½ .
Its really up to you . So my answer I guess is a question ; what is it you want or thinking you want .
Post by: RobD on August 17, 2013, 07:58:24 AM
what i'm asking are commented reasons as to why one prefers a specific caliber, stock wood genus, stock design, lock type/size, overall design, etc.
that is to say, criteria - if any - that determines the spex on a squirrel rifle one would prefer, and why that preference. functional stuff, embellishments excluded.
as a purely hypothetical example, one might say that he/she finds a longer barrel either more accurate or more cumbersome in the woods - or both.
Post by: 2 Locks on August 17, 2013, 11:47:55 AM
OK, my choice is based more on my hunting style than anything else. I would rather range & explore the woods while hunting. I'm not much for sitting & waiting for squirrels to show themselves so I can take careful aim.
So my choice is not a rifle at all, but a side by side shotgun. I wish it was a flinter, but it is a cap lock. I like it because it is an original dating to about 1870, and it gives me some sort of satisfaction that I'm keeping this old gun in use.
I hunt by walking the woods looking for squirrels ahead, and then stalk them. When they see me coming (and they always do) I charge ahead, and they usually run giving more of "bird like" shot rather than an aimed shot. The relatively short length (45" OAL) gives me greater mobility while I'm making that charge.
Back to Rifles: I have done the sit & wait method, and used my .45 flinter in those cases. I prefer long barrels. This one is 44 inches. It is my opinion that a long barrel does not necessarily give the gun greater accuracy, but the longer distance between the sights gives the shooter a slight advantage in aiming.
When taking an aimed head shot at a squirrel, I don't feel that the ball size matters at all. If you hit them in the head with anything moving that fast they are dead. And I don't eat the head. I will concede that if you miss to the body side, of course you will tear up less meat, and the smaller calibers make for much nicer pictures at the end of the day. Larger balls also give you an advantage if you try to "bark" a squirrel whose head is not visible. I could be described as more of a bull-in-a-china-shop as opposed to finesse person, and I would probably break ramrods for smaller calibers way too easily.
There is also the pair hunting style that is somewhere in between. Here a partner/dog/grand-kid chases the squirrel around the tree, while the shooter waits quietly for a shot. I have not tried this method personally, but I would imagine that shorter barrel lengths may help with maneuverability in this hunting style.
As for stocks, my preference is for full stocked rifles. I like tiger striped maple the best. The choice should be influenced by your persona, but a man of any means could have saved/traded-up for his dream rifle. Mario might disagree with that point.
If you buy/build whatever type of gun you want, it will subconsciously give you greater confidence which is in turn likely to lead to better results. So while it is wise to ask, you will only be getting opinions, and ultimately you will need make the choice that you feel is best for you.
Good luck, and be sure to let us see a picture of your first squirrel alongside your new gun.
Post by: RobD on August 17, 2013, 12:00:03 PM
Post by: RobD on August 17, 2013, 01:36:14 PM
when i grow up, i wanna be just like mr. house.
Post by: Captchee on August 17, 2013, 06:31:11 PM
The other issue is that with a longer barrel , as you slim it down , it becomes easily bent .
I litteraly had one heck of a time with the one in the photos because I could actually with no trouble pull the muzzle over a good inch with the breech in the vice
When it came to the stock wood , it was personal preference in that she liked the figured black walnut much better then the English or maple I had .
Sight wise while a longer barrel can help out , it also can create a hindrance in that on hot days or after some firing , the heat waves can make the front sight harder to see ..
This gets compounded if it’s a thinner lighter barrel
Post by: RobD on August 17, 2013, 06:41:22 PM
Post by: biliff on August 17, 2013, 07:21:47 PM
Post by: RobD on August 17, 2013, 08:59:57 PM
Post by: RobD on August 18, 2013, 06:26:12 PM
Post by: Uncle Russ on August 18, 2013, 11:59:06 PM
Quote from: "rfd"
does anyone feel that a 32 is more of a chore to shoot/clean than a larger caliber squirrel rifle?
I've kinda watch this thread since it's first post, and I haven't commented because, right now, right this moment, I don't own a "three-two"..... but I have, and I have owned several over the years, both cap and flint and I do expect to own another one before the fall of this upcoming year.
IMHO, the lowly little three-two is the most underrated muzzle loader we have today!
As far as your last question, I certainly don't feel it's any more of a chore insofar as shooting and cleaning than any other BP Rifle...although, I have to admit that over the years I have broken more three-two ram rods than all the others combined!
Still yet, even a slow learner catches on pretty quick after awhile.
And, it does take me a second or so longer to load and seat a ball than it does on a .45 on up.
Why is that? It's because on the larger bores I can typically seat a ball with one or sometimes two quick long strokes, while that smaller bore requires four or five short strokes, and it's usually a 40 plus inch barrel...IMO that's the very reason we ended up with so many broken ram rods for this little fella.
The exception to this "may be" the little .32 Cherokee RM mentioned...it does have a short barrel, but there ain't no fleas on that little dog....and you can take that to the Bank!
Now, having said that, I have to say that I personally don't see this as any kind of drawback, as we all have access to good hickory rods nowadays.
Is it as good or better than a .36?
Is it as good or better than a .40 or .45?
Good questions, but I would not like having the responsibility of being the one to make that choice.
The little three-two speaks Skwerl in several languages and dialects, and no Sir, you're at no disadvantage when carrying one in Squirrel country.
Uncle Russ...
Post by: RobD on August 19, 2013, 05:27:17 AM
getting back into black powder muzzleloaders after a 3 decade layoff has given me an appreciation for ramrods and "cleaning rods". i know some folks don't clean much 'tween shots but i do. it sure is all about the fit of the ball 'n' patch for me. with my current carolina .45 i'm using 55 grains of goex 3fg under a .012" dutch lubed muzzle cut flannel patch (gives my 20 year LL bean shirts a new occupation) and a .440" ball. if i do my job right, the accuracy so far is pretty decent ... here's my first target face from this past friday's shooting, 37 yards and five balls touching - the 4 o'clock hole was my bud's shot, not mine ...
(http://i.imgur.com/xAsh7Y9.jpg)
... to tie in the above rambling with thoughts on a thutty-too rifle --- i use a 3/8" brass rod (with brass muzzle guide) to wipe well 'tween shots, then use the rifle's hickory rod to seat the ball on the black dust. the patched ball goes down nicely each time, no muss and no fuss. i would expect the same using a 1/4" brass cleaning/wiping rod, but i'm guessing at this point. i think it's gonna be a decent good guess.
Post by: R.M. on August 19, 2013, 10:31:11 AM
Post by: RobD on August 19, 2013, 12:39:46 PM
Post by: biliff on August 19, 2013, 12:59:09 PM
Quote from: "rfd"
does anyone feel that a 32 is more of a chore to shoot/clean than a larger caliber squirrel rifle?
Only problem I ran across was handling the tiny balls (don't go there). Ended up making a rawhide ball bag with a bit of a chute at the mouth so I could dispense them one at a time.
Also found I could load a much tighter ball/patch combination. .318" ball, drill patch, spit lube and I can shoot all day with no wiping. Cleanup also got a lot quicker.
Rods/jags etc. are readily available online from the usual suspects. Forget buying stuff locally unless you have a muzzleloader specialty shop nearby.
Post by: RobD on August 19, 2013, 06:20:07 PM
real interesting about the .318 balls for a .32! i was thinking of a .311 or .315 ball mould .... hmmm.
(http://i.imgur.com/ebbmrWn.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/mi5X7bC.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/Ap2P50d.jpg)
Post by: RobD on August 19, 2013, 06:38:11 PM
Post by: biliff on August 19, 2013, 07:35:56 PM
Nice idea for storing ball in the pouch. Not sure if it would work for me with a .32. I just can't seem to grab the little things very well.
Post by: RobD on August 19, 2013, 07:50:52 PM
Post by: 2 Locks on August 19, 2013, 08:16:38 PM
Quote from: "rfd"
perhaps a stainless 1/4" rod would be stiffer than one of brass?Steel, hard, bad.
Brass, soft, good.
Carbon fiber would be even stiffer than steel - and even more abrasive.
Post by: biliff on August 19, 2013, 09:03:22 PM
Quote from: "rfd"
don't understand how the starter and patch is getting hung up. are you using preformed round patches or a patch strip 'n' knife? what diameter is yer short starter for the 32?
Brass rod and ball. Precut square patches. Rod was so close to bore diameter that the excess patch material would grab the rod when seating the ball and bind in the barrel. Just turned the end of the rod down enough to keep it from binding.
Post by: RobD on August 19, 2013, 09:09:29 PM
Post by: RobD on August 19, 2013, 09:17:00 PM
Quote from: "biliff"
Quote from: "rfd"don't understand how the starter and patch is getting hung up. are you using preformed round patches or a patch strip 'n' knife? what diameter is yer short starter for the 32?
Brass rod and ball. Precut square patches. Rod was so close to bore diameter that the excess patch material would grab the rod when seating the ball and bind in the barrel. Just turned the end of the rod down enough to keep it from binding.
ah. precut patches. i'll bet you won't have that issue with cut patch strips.
Post by: sse on August 20, 2013, 09:51:14 AM
Quote from: "rfd"
imo, a stainless steel cleaning rod is not at all bad if used correctly, with a properly sized front end and with a muzzle bore guide.Can't disagree with ya there, but does a switch to steel really improve the process?
Post by: RobD on August 20, 2013, 10:06:18 AM
Quote from: "sse"
Quote from: "rfd"imo, a stainless steel cleaning rod is not at all bad if used correctly, with a properly sized front end and with a muzzle bore guide.Can't disagree with ya there, but does a switch to steel really improve the process?
IMHO - the business of ramrods has everything to do with friction/effort. and sometimes a really stiff rod might be required so to lessen its bend (if any) in trying to wipe the bore.
if there's significant friction on the cleaning/wiping jag/patch, that will mean the rod's gonna bend, and i don't care how stiff the rod is from the get-go. with the right jag diameter and cleaning patch thickness, one can clean/wipe the bore without a hickory ramrod bending much if at all. but if the jag/patch has a tight fit to begin with, and it's gotta pass the built up crud, that rod's gonna bend - less so with brass, and far less so with s/s.
so to the point - how stiff the rod needs to be is really about how much effort will be needed to push the patched jag down the barrel and wipe out the crud, which can at times be baked on. jmho and ymmv.
Post by: sse on August 20, 2013, 10:11:32 AM
Post by: Captchee on August 21, 2013, 07:36:25 AM
The key however to using those steel and stainless , is the muzzle guide and a soft jag made of brass , German silver or such. You don’t want the steel hitting the rifling .
When it comes to whats good for a cleaning and loading rod . Yes a good hickory rod is hard to beat . Over time however when used in the modern cleaning application , the tips can become lose and eventually break or pull off. But if built properly , that takes some time to happen .
I say modern because today cleaning jags are the most common used . Where in the historic context , tow worms were far more common .
I would also point out that not only must the rod be strong enough to push through , it must be strong enough to pull back as the backward motion is actually tighter . The reason for it being tighter is that a small amount of the cleaning patch bunchs up on the back side of the jag as you pull out . Thus the larger the amount of patch material you have behind the jag , the tighter it will get . That action is why jags have rings cut to them , in that it give the patch a place to bunch up and helps the jag hold the patch .
There also are 2 types of jags , button jags and necked jags .
Button jags work great when you have a rod that smaller then the jag itself . Because of the size difference, the patch wads up back of the jag and doesn’t wad up to the point it wont pull . But as you get down to smaller bores where the rod is often not much smaller then the jag and there is no room for the patch to wad up . that’s where the necked jags come to play . That neck and then resulting taper back to rod size , gives the excess cleaning material place to go as you pull the rod back up in your cleaning motion .
Also when it comes to using a RR with jag attached fro loading “ this isn’t uncommon “
All of the above again comes into play if you have excess patch material around the ball . IE if your using an oversized precut patch . What happens is as you push the ball down , the excess material ends up not only around the ball but also around the jag . As you withdraw the road , that extra material wads up and the jag grabs it .. Thus it tries to pull the patch an ball back out .
Using less patch material buy cutting at the muzzle will work to solve the problem as long as you don’t set the ball to deep prior to ramming it home , adjusting your jag size or loading without a jag will also solve the problem
Post by: R.M. on August 21, 2013, 11:54:59 AM
Quote from: "rfd"
rm, please share your source for the 9/32" rod!
Here's where I got it. http://www.speedymetals.com/ (http://www.speedymetals.com/)
Post by: RobD on August 21, 2013, 12:21:46 PM
Post by: R.M. on August 21, 2013, 12:27:27 PM
Post by: RobD on August 21, 2013, 12:28:23 PM
Post by: sse on August 21, 2013, 01:20:39 PM
Post by: VEDearduff on August 28, 2013, 04:03:24 PM
Here is a photo.
(http://i272.photobucket.com/albums/jj171/vedearduff/Shooting/Guns/Flintlocks/SquirrelRifle.jpg)
Post by: RobD on August 28, 2013, 04:16:20 PM
Post by: trent/OH on August 28, 2013, 07:58:08 PM
P.S.: Write down the words you say when the powder is in your eye just as soon as possible. Chances are that you never even heard some of them, much less spoken them aloud.
Post by: sse on August 29, 2013, 09:54:46 AM
Quote from: "trent/OH"
P.S.: Write down the words you say when the powder is in your eye just as soon as possible. Chances are that you never even heard some of them, much less spoken them aloud.LOL
Post by: 1911tex on August 30, 2013, 09:31:16 AM
Post by: sse on August 30, 2013, 12:46:21 PM
Quote from: "1911tex"
trent/OH: Dont ask how I know how right you are !Well I can ask...How do you know...? LOL
Post by: 1911tex on August 30, 2013, 01:05:18 PM
Post by: sse on August 30, 2013, 01:07:49 PM
Post by: 1911tex on August 30, 2013, 01:23:42 PM
Post by: geneC on December 04, 2013, 04:49:09 PM
Post by: Hanshi on December 06, 2013, 03:21:53 PM
(http://i599.photobucket.com/albums/tt74/hanshi_photo/PICT0577-2-1-1.jpg) (http://http)
Post by: suzkat on January 11, 2014, 07:30:44 PM
one other time. If I recall it was on a Melchoir Fordney rifle. Beautiful rifle.
Post by: Captchee on January 12, 2014, 08:57:27 AM
Post by: Kermit on March 26, 2014, 08:33:32 PM
Had a .36 Seneca that was cute and accurate, but traded it off. Caps, you know.
Had a .32 x 36" flinter. Too short in both barrel and stock, so it too was traded off. There is probably another .32 for me. Just have to live long enough.I think of 42" barrels as about as short as I could possibly go.
Post by: the Black Spot on April 17, 2014, 11:11:16 AM
Post by: wes k on April 17, 2014, 07:52:01 PM
(http://i1097.photobucket.com/albums/g352/mx160/D71AB313-D557-4624-9BE2-B72ED5237405.jpg) (http://http)
Post by: Kermit on April 17, 2014, 10:18:12 PM
Post by: sse on April 17, 2014, 11:50:22 PM
Quote from: "wes k"
Love my .32 40" barrelThat is a beautiful rifle and a great pic...thanks for the effort...
(http://i1097.photobucket.com/albums/g352/mx160/D71AB313-D557-4624-9BE2-B72ED5237405.jpg) (http://http)
Post by: Uncle Russ on April 21, 2014, 11:55:00 AM
I have read that Squirrel Hunting is the "Prince of the Hunting Sport", and my own somewhat limited experience, while stationed and living in Skwerl Hunting Country, certainly parallels that thought. Maybe it's because of the beautiful and accurate little rifles we choose for the sport, but maybe it's something else.
At any rate, I sure do miss those early mornings spent under a canopy of hardwoods found in so many of our more Eastern states....but the memories are still there, and they are still clear as a bell.
Uncle Russ..
Post by: Hanshi on April 21, 2014, 11:41:56 PM