Traditional Muzzleloading Association

Traditional Firearms => Caplock Pistols => Topic started by: ridjrunr on March 24, 2012, 06:36:39 PM

Title: oddball pistol
Post by: ridjrunr on March 24, 2012, 06:36:39 PM
Is anyone familiar with this pistol? the mechanism works great, but two things I find very odd. There is no rifleing and there are two dovetails cut in the barrel, front and rear, and you could never see the sights because of the hammer and nipple.Also, there appears to be teflon tape where the barrel screws into the brass section that houses the nipple. The ID of the barrel is .440. It is marked  

                                          CMC
                                         xxxxxA
                                        PAT  PEND


Thanks for any input, ridjrunr

( and I just discovered, it appears to be loaded  :shock:  )
Title: Re: oddball pistol
Post by: Spotted Bull on March 24, 2012, 07:43:57 PM
Looks like a New Orleans Ace. My wife has one. The dovetails are for little rings that hold a ramrod. Only problem my wife has with hers is that it has a tendency to break nipples...spring too strong!
Title: Re: oddball pistol
Post by: ridjrunr on March 24, 2012, 08:27:50 PM
Is hers without rifleing as well? Does hers measure .440 too ?
Title: Re: oddball pistol
Post by: greyhunter on March 24, 2012, 09:26:23 PM
They are smooth bores, sold by Dixie Gun works. Kinda like a Queen Anne? screw barrel.  Sold as kits, they may still sell them. Under table gun, beyond that, just a noise maker. Had one, traded to a member for a horn. .440 sounds right.
Title: Re: oddball pistol
Post by: Bigsmoke on March 24, 2012, 09:56:08 PM
I found that if you tilted it at about a 45 degree angle, you could at least get an idea of where you were shooting.  Strictly a belly gun, hence the moniker, New Orleans Ace.  Let er rip under the card table and your opponent will be singing soprano. :rotf
If I recall correctly, they were intended to shoot a .433 rb.  using a hammer, I was able to load .440's into mine, lo these many years ago.
Title: Re: oddball pistol
Post by: ridjrunr on March 25, 2012, 12:08:41 AM
Thank you for the input. I did get it unloaded, powder and ball with no patch. Odd thing. a belly gun indeed.
Title: Re: oddball pistol
Post by: Spotted Bull on March 25, 2012, 09:27:46 AM
We used them at a ministry for kids to shoot...most of the little kids didn't care where the ball went as long as it went bang when they pulled the trigger!
Title: Re: oddball pistol
Post by: Semisane on March 25, 2012, 10:31:56 PM
Here's mine.  I've found it's good for two things; loading with a powder charge and a paper towel wad to make noise and smoke on the Forth of July and New Years' Eve, and loading with a powder charge, toilet paper wad, 1/2 ounce of #8 shot, overshot wad cut from an egg carton, and blasting away at anything that tickles your fancy.  As far as shooting balls, you'd better be very close and the target better be very big.  ;)

(http://i210.photobucket.com/albums/bb264/NavZepol/2-3.jpg)
Title: Re: oddball pistol
Post by: ridjrunr on March 25, 2012, 11:02:27 PM
Thank you semisane !  Thats kind of what I thought, mine is a swamp meet special and just couldnt pass it up  :oops:
Title: Re: oddball pistol
Post by: Semisane on March 26, 2012, 01:29:12 AM
Ridjrunr, don't be afraid to unscrew the barrel.  It should unscrew fairly easily.  I take mine off by hand for cleaning.
Title: Re: oddball pistol
Post by: Captchee on March 26, 2012, 09:59:08 AM
dan .
 if you need some parts , i  know i have another barrel . the ram rod  loops for the dove tailsand i think a ram rod  ,hammer and  trigger as well .  i dont have the breech though .
as a note , i saw a fellas selling a number of those up at Monroe  for 150.00 .
 over 1/2 sold the first day
Title: Re: oddball pistol
Post by: Bison Horn on March 27, 2012, 12:55:55 AM
Quote from: "Captchee"
dan .

as a note , i saw a fellas selling a number of those up at Monroe  for 150.00 .
 over 1/2 sold the first day
Wow guess those went up in price I bought a kit from Dixie many years ago seems like I paid very little for it, must be inflation.lol
Title: Re: oddball pistol
Post by: snake eyes on March 27, 2012, 07:58:04 AM
Quote from: "Bison Horn"
Quote from: "Captchee"
dan .

as a note , i saw a fellas selling a number of those up at Monroe  for 150.00 .
 over 1/2 sold the first day
Wow guess those went up in price I bought a kit from Dixie many years ago seems like I paid very little for it, must be inflation.lol
Bison Horn,
                 I agree in the inflation thing......I to bought two rifles from DGW maybe
12 years ago and the same two guns today the price has nearly doubled.
Yep I am sure inflation is a part of it,for the most part.But on the other hand I would like to think interest in B/P shooting is part of the inflation issue....That is what I would like
to think.......But on the other hand....Maybe it is like modern gun sales :Doh!  Buy what ever you can before you can't buy anything....and do not exclude ammo. IMHO
Title: Re: oddball pistol
Post by: Captchee on March 27, 2012, 10:35:03 AM
Quote from: "snake eyes"
Quote from: "Bison Horn"
Quote from: "Captchee"
dan .

as a note , i saw a fellas selling a number of those up at Monroe  for 150.00 .
 over 1/2 sold the first day
Wow guess those went up in price I bought a kit from Dixie many years ago seems like I paid very little for it, must be inflation.lol
Bison Horn,
                 I agree in the inflation thing......I to bought two rifles from DGW maybe
12 years ago and the same two guns today the price has nearly doubled.
Yep I am sure inflation is a part of it,for the most part.But on the other hand I would like to think interest in B/P shooting is part of the inflation issue....That is what I would like
to think.......But on the other hand....Maybe it is like modern gun sales :Doh!  Buy what ever you can before you can't buy anything....and do not exclude ammo. IMHO

as the dollar becomes worth less , it takes more to buy  what one wants .
 i remember buying locks from Bud siler . 45.00.
 very nice Trigger  guards  cast in silver were 5 .oo , brass 3.00 and  steel  1.50 . take a look at the cost today .
 CVA rifles were 50-75.00. Pedersoli 125.00 -200.00 . priced a Pedersoli lately ?
 There was a time not all that long ago that 125.00 for a cap and ball pistol  was  a lot .
 Not today

Take a look at barrels . In the last 2 years they have went up over 75.00 . Locks  up 25-30 .

  U at the Monroe show I was simply astounded to see so many CVA and Jukar Kentucky rifles   with the asking price  any where from 175 all the way to 250 .  Basically nothing done to them either.
 You know what , they were selling to  
 Odd times we live in for sure
Title: Re: oddball pistol
Post by: Captchee on March 29, 2012, 04:23:42 AM
ok . i did some looking in my old 1976 catalogs
 On  top of what Dixie sells , the New Orleans Ace was sold by both Century , Classic Arms  companies
I seem to recall that CVA  as well as Jukar  also listed the Ace .
 But anyway
 Both companies offered both smooth and rifled barrels in 44 cal  .
Century  arms Offered it in kit form  for 29.95 for the smooth and 31.95 for the rifled  bore .

Personally I think they all were imported pieces
Anyway  they  listed  the new Orleans Ace at 44.95 smooth  and 46.95 for the rifled   as a finished piece
 They also offered  it in Kit form . But I don’t have a price for that .
It would also appear that  both companies  used this same receiver for their 3 barreled 36 cal Duckfoot
 But I cant say with 100% certainty as I cant seem to find my parts catalog for  those companies .
 If you do a Google  for  this gun, and look at the auction sites , what you find is they are selling anywhere from 50-60 bucks in poor shape  up to 139-150 cleaned up

 These type of guns were  often referred to as pocket pistols . So looking for that  you can find more information concerning originals that  the ACE kinda loosely resembles  .
  IE like we used to say in the scale RC ; Its Squint scale
Title: Re: oddball pistol
Post by: Captchee on August 02, 2012, 11:14:24 AM
OK so Dan sent his New Orleans Ace  to me to do a little work  on her for him
   As you can see in the first photo , the hammer had never been finished . He was missing some parts . Stock had never been worked over past the point of its original shape .
Which by the way  was a piece of walnut . Real poor quality . After removing it , it had some splits that needed stabilized . So I did that and then reshaped it a little and put on an oil finish .   Thus giving it slimmer lines and a more sleek look  that a self respecting Gambler  might be looking for.
 I also finished out the hammer and trigger . Then I case hardened both . As was expected the  steel quality  didn’t  take much of the case color but  they still came out nice .
 I then re-crowned  the barrel and polished it  and faced it so as to bring the RR back down to the bottom .
 
 I then engraved the barrel  and receiver with leaf bands  for a base to the arch based leaf  work . Around the nipple seat I  did a rope boarder .
Each side of the receiver , on the flats I engrave a poker hand . Specifically a Royal Flush  in spades .

Added to that I finally go around to getting my 35mm  Minolta X700  out. But  I found out its shutter had stuck .  So out came my Sony D100  digital .  I never really learned how to use it  so after a couple days of reading  and digging for some of my old camera gear   I finally was able to take some decent photos. Still not the best but far better then those I have posted before .

So anyway here is Dans  pistol in its new form  .
 it was a fun project Dan , Thank you for giving me the opportunity and your willingness to allow me to do some practice on your gun . I hope you like what I have done  

so here is the before shot
(http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y242/captchee/engraving/100_57065B15D.jpg)

and here is what she looks like now

(http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y242/captchee/engraving/DSC00780.jpg)

(http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y242/captchee/engraving/DSC00785.jpg)

(http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y242/captchee/engraving/DSC00775.jpg)

(http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y242/captchee/engraving/DSC00772.jpg)
Title: Re: oddball pistol
Post by: R.M. on August 02, 2012, 11:17:48 AM
Wow, great job Charles.  :lt th
Title: Re: oddball pistol
Post by: Hanshi on August 02, 2012, 11:20:42 AM
Delightful pistol!
Title: Re: oddball pistol
Post by: Captchee on August 02, 2012, 11:21:16 AM
Quote from: "R.M."
Wow, great job Charles.  :lt th

thank you , its was alot of fun  enjoyed it greatly
Title: Re: oddball pistol
Post by: rickevans on August 02, 2012, 11:28:19 AM
Wow!!!  I am not sure what you call that, but it is way more than a finishing-up and make-over.
Title: Re: oddball pistol
Post by: Captchee on August 02, 2012, 11:31:43 AM
Quote from: "rickevans"
Wow!!!  I am not sure what you call that, but it is way more than a finishing-up and make-over.

why ???? its a "pimp"  your gun  :toast
Title: Re: oddball pistol
Post by: Riley/MN on August 02, 2012, 12:39:55 PM
Way to go Charlie - That looks great!
Title: Re: oddball pistol
Post by: rickevans on August 02, 2012, 06:22:30 PM
That's the phrase for sure Captchee!
Title: Re: oddball pistol
Post by: ridjrunr on August 02, 2012, 08:52:14 PM
Wholy Cats !, Thank you Charlie!
even though I figured this would be something original,it kinda blows me away.
You are very gifted not only as a craftsman but an artist as well.
Thank you so much !,  :toast
ridjrunr
Title: Re: oddball pistol
Post by: Captchee on August 03, 2012, 12:22:34 AM
thanks for the kind words  dan ,glad  you like it  .
Title: Re: oddball pistol
Post by: Semisane on August 03, 2012, 01:55:35 AM
I bow to your talent and skill sir.  Beautiful job!

I have an original design underhammer style rifle build underway. It has two flat sideplates of polished mild steel that would look great engraved. Do you undertake such work?
Title: Re: oddball pistol
Post by: Captchee on August 03, 2012, 10:33:39 AM
.
Quote from: "Semisane"
I bow to your talent and skill sir.  Beautiful job!

I have an original design underhammer style rifle build underway. It has two flat sideplates of polished mild steel that would look great engraved. Do you undertake such work?

thank you for the kind words
 yep i do as well as full builds . full custom , semi custom and  revamps
 long rifles ,half stocks , SXS , trade guns . and a number of smoothbores
 if you go to my face book page “.
you will see a number of my work in my photo album. One of which is a under hammer I did for chair slayer here on the TMA forum.
 not much in the engraving area as  i was having trouble with my hands . but now im back at it so there will be more engraving to come .
 i have been ask to do an a fully engraved Centaure.  That I will be probably starting early spring  and will take some considerable time .
 I also have a 1860 and a 1851 on the bench waiting to be engraved

 here is the link to a few of my works
http://[url=http://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.111019235617469.9964.100001281797627&type=3&l=526a37b323]http://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set= ... 526a37b323[/url]
Title: Re: oddball pistol
Post by: sse on August 03, 2012, 03:47:39 PM
Very snazzy, cap... :bl th up
Title: Re: oddball pistol
Post by: ridjrunr on August 18, 2012, 12:39:37 PM
Its even better in the hand !!   :toast
Title: Re: oddball pistol
Post by: Riley/MN on August 18, 2012, 12:44:29 PM
:hairy
Title: Re: oddball pistol
Post by: Captchee on August 18, 2012, 11:09:17 PM
Quote from: "ridjrunr"
Its even better in the hand !!   :toast

thanks Dan .
glad you like it
 i also just got your phone message
 im working nights so . i sleep through the day .
 ill give you a call in the morning