"CROOKED KNIFE"???- Puffer

[Puffer]

As many of you know, the NWC & HBC, in the PNW, are of "prime" interest to me.

One of my main interests is David Thompson.
I presently got a GREAT book on his time @ the Saleesh House  ( I highly recommend this book ) http://www.davidthompsonbook.com/

One of the areas that intrigues me is the tools that these men used to build their buildings, canoes etc. In his book,Carl Haywood, discusses many of the techniques & tools used. To my surprise, he mentions a "CROOKED KNIFE" as being a necessity to these men.

Here is a pic. [albumimg:2lthaduq]4172[/albumimg:2lthaduq]

& Here is a site that has them.http://www.davidthompsonbook.com/

Does anyone have more info ??
Has anyone made &/or used one

Puffer

[woodman]

A crooked knife is used for carving and shaping. I have and use one in my shop a great deal of the time.
   Woodcraft and Highline Hardware are two sources for modern made ones.
 Woodman

[Three Hawks]

The crooked knife is a Pan-Boreal tool, basically used by peoples  near  the Arctic Circle all around the globe.  None are standardized except very locally and most are made by the user to his own desires.  They are almost unknown below the Arctic Circle, the closest tool to a crooked knife is the farrier's hoof knife.

Due to distribution by speciality mail order tool outlets  they are becoming more and more common in Southern climes.    This is quite similar to the availability of very specialized traditional Japanese wood working tools.

Three Hawks

[Pitchy]

Looks like a hoof knife, bet ya could take the blade from one of those and put a antler handle on it and have the same thing.

[Three Hawks]

Looks like a hoof knife, bet ya could take the blade from one of those and put a antler handle on it and have the same thing.

In some cases a hoof knife will answer well for a crooked knife.  

There is no standardized pattern of crooked knife.  there are some tendencies to similarity of shapes used for similar cutting tasks, but that's as far as it goes.  There are left handed, right handed, shallow curve and sharp curve blades in myriad styles, some will have hard angular bends, some soft.   They will be found with top and bottom bevels as well.  Some are dirt simple and some are works of art.  Again, no standard shapes or styles.

Handles can be made from any hard material including wood, plastic, antler, ivory and bone.  I've seen handles fastened with everything from rawhide, nylon tie wraps, fishing line, epoxy, friction tape, copper and steel wire, rivets and grocery string, just to name a few.   A good friend has a dozen or so crooked knives he made for his own use, he prefers curved pieces of Spruce root for handles and fastens them with copper wire windings soldered in place.  He also decorates the handles with his family fetishes, Raven and Turtle.  By the way, he's full blood Haida.

The European "equivalent" of the crooked knife is the draw knife.

Three Hawks

[woodman]

But you are forgetting some of the Swiss type blades used for chip carving have the same type blade in the european world.
  Crooked knife is a more new world name , but i have seen old carving knifes with the same profile in old tool boxes that I have studied.
 Woodman

[Voyageur]

Puffer I use a crooked knife in my woodcarving. Though it's not used on a lot of projects, but when carving wood bowls, spoons, ladles---I rather use the crooked knife then a scorp.   "Doc"

[Pichou]

Puffer you should watch this movie online:

http://beta.nfb.ca/film/cree_hunters/

Only a little on the mocotaugan/couteau croche, but you will enjoy it.

[Kermit]

And you should definitely take a look at Gregg Blomberg's stuff at Kestrel Tools up on Lopez Island.

http://www.rockisland.com/~kestrel/crooked.html

I have five of Gregg's crooked knives and two of his adzes. They are the finest blades in my arsenal. I don't know what alchemy he's privy to, but you can't buy finer. Cheaper, yes; finer, no. And since he's trying to retire somewhat and is now working alone, you might have to wait for tools. I think he's pretty much working on as-ordered these days.

Take a look at all the sizes/profiles he offers. Amazing.

[Kermit]

Some crooked knife work in here too.

http://beta.nfb.ca/film/Cesars_Bark_Canoe/

[Mike Ameling]

A lot of the modern Spoon carvers also now use a variation of the crook knife.  

And to most people used to "whittling" style of push-away cutting, the Pull type cutting stroke takes a lot of getting used to.

For a first Crook Knife, you should tend towards a short blade with gentle curve instead of a long blade or one with a sharp bend/curve.  "Leverage" is much more important with a crook knife.

Mikey

[attheedgeoftheworld]

tried hoof knife and it was a waste of money. I have seen a few originals and some modern repros.  Some times they go for big bucks. I know if one takes a file, pounds out the file mark and puts the proper bends in a file it will work great. I would do this but I am lacking a forge to do so.  
just my 2cents
raymond

[Kermit]

Here's Kesterl Tool's prices:

http://www.rockisland.com/~kestrel/crooked_price.html

At $48 for a knife, I consider them a good deal. They come complete and scary sharp. If you are at all handy, you can get his blades only for $14, complete with instructions on how to make the proper handles.

[Pichou]

That's a lot better than the Pakistan prices.

[jr]

online book - http://www.mocotauganthebook.com/
You don't need a forge to make the blades. They can be completely shaped with files and then bent while cold if the steel is annealed well. Then the heat treat - final sharpening.
caribooblades has a good article on his website on making them and also sells them. The ones i've seen that are supposed to be Hudson's Bay Great Lakes style(like the repro you show Puffer), have a long blade, curved at the end, no point, and a single edge, not at all like the modern made kestrel or caribooblades ones.
In "Fort Pontchartrain at Detroit" by Kent, and "Michilimackinac 1715-1781" by Stone there are a few drawingsand  photos with dimensions of blades found there. They show a couple with double edges but the overall shape is still the same.
The ones that taper to a sharp point at the tip seem to be a North West Coast and far North style, maybe homemade? and maybe? not a product from HBC or other fur trade company.
An infamous metal detector,digger upper,ebay seller, shows this one on his website, and it's the shape of the ones usually found around the Great Lakes, although his 1600s date seems off?
http://www.bobsphotogallery.com/gallery ... or2/album/