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Author Topic: GPR Lock Improvement  (Read 5564 times)

Online RobD

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Re: GPR Lock Improvement
« Reply #30 on: November 02, 2016, 12:45:21 PM »
what's all this nonsense about patched ball loading with a bouncing ramrod?  

early on, way back in the late 50's, a few of the local old geezers showed this teenage boy how and why to bounce the rod.  i said that ain't right, it'll mash the ball, why do that when you can push the patched ball home?  

one feller took hold of the little .36 skwerl rifle i had just loaded, and placed the rod down in barrel and said to note where the rod was marked at the muzzle, then he bounced the rod a few times - the first few easy rod flicks wouldn't get the rod to bounce, but the few after that made the rod look like it was vaulting up from a trampoline.  leaving the rod down the barrel, the mark at the muzzle moved down nearly 1/8".  

he said that'll make sure there's no air space 'tween ball and powder, and that'll compact (er, he meant 'compress') the powder for better performance.  i said, yeah, but ya just mashed my nice round ball flat on one side.  he said no.  i said yes.  he grabbed the rod and showed me that the pusher end was concave, and between that rod end cavity and the fact that it also beat on the edge of the patching as much as the ball kept it from going flat.  besides, he said, shouldn't yer firm tapping of the last few ramrod strokes have mashed it flat, too?  hmmm.

so i started ramrod bounce loading.  

sometime later on, maybe that week or month, i dry balled yet another patched .490 or .530 ball, and pulled it with a small screw worm.  aside from the 1/8" screw hole, the rest of the ball was what makes a ball, a ball - it was as round as when i thumb pushed it in the muzzle.  

i guess some old guys do know some good stuff.

Offline JStanley

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Re: GPR Lock Improvement
« Reply #31 on: November 02, 2016, 02:00:12 PM »
This topic was the source of an informal experiment documented here
 http://www.blackpowdermag.com/load-compression-and-accuracy/
and supports what rfd is describing.  They have some other interesting experiments that I enjoyed reading.  I'm always in the learning mode, no matter how old I get. :bl th up

Offline JStanley

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Re: GPR Lock Improvement
« Reply #32 on: November 02, 2016, 03:02:02 PM »
Quote from: "rollingb"
Quote from: "JStanley"
Here is the touch hole on my GPR. I've heard others say their GPR had the same problem.
You can't move the barrel and tang forewards without creating a problem, and you can't move the lock rear-ward without creating another problem,... so if it was mine, I'd remove the touch hole liner, plug the hole with a metric bolt (be sure it is flush with the inside bore wall), cut the bolt off and file smooth,.... then mark the barrel in the proper location for a new touch hole, and re-drill and re-tap a new touch hole further forewards (using a standard thread for the liner instead of metric). :rt th

After thinking about your recommendation, I came across a thought that might present a problem.  After plugging the original metric hole and drilling a new one on center with the pan cavity, will the remaining piece of plug (green area) be stable?  What would keep it from falling out when the new vent (blue) is removed?

What if I could move the pan cavity aft to be centered on the current vent position?  Could a person fill the current pan cavity with say carefully laid tig weld, and then using a ball end mill of the correct diameter, re-machine the new pan cavity (purple) on center with the existing vent?

Since the pan cover is flat, it wouldn't be affected by the move.  Sparks should still find their way to the prime, right?

Offline Muley

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Re: GPR Lock Improvement
« Reply #33 on: November 02, 2016, 03:09:47 PM »
No easy solution. I hope mine is centered when I get it. I don't like either of those options.
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Offline Muley

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Re: GPR Lock Improvement
« Reply #34 on: November 02, 2016, 05:46:15 PM »
My only hope is mine is LH. Maybe they did a better job on it.
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Online rollingb

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Re: GPR Lock Improvement
« Reply #35 on: November 02, 2016, 05:47:46 PM »
Quote from: "JStanley"
Quote from: "rollingb"
Quote from: "JStanley"
Here is the touch hole on my GPR. I've heard others say their GPR had the same problem.
You can't move the barrel and tang forewards without creating a problem, and you can't move the lock rear-ward without creating another problem,... so if it was mine, I'd remove the touch hole liner, plug the hole with a metric bolt (be sure it is flush with the inside bore wall), cut the bolt off and file smooth,.... then mark the barrel in the proper location for a new touch hole, and re-drill and re-tap a new touch hole further forewards (using a standard thread for the liner instead of metric). :shock:  :laffing)
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Offline amm1851

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Re: GPR Lock Improvement
« Reply #36 on: November 02, 2016, 06:16:03 PM »
I have never had any problems with any of the four Lyman muzzleloaders I have owned/own.
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Online RobD

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Re: GPR Lock Improvement
« Reply #37 on: November 02, 2016, 06:24:56 PM »
js - did you buy yer gun new or used?  if new, how long ago?

Offline JStanley

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Re: GPR Lock Improvement
« Reply #38 on: November 02, 2016, 08:33:27 PM »
Quote from: "Rob DiStefano"
js - did you buy yer gun new or used?  if new, how long ago?

I traded for it - it was unfired though. When it arrived it looked like it had been sparked (dry fired) a few times but other than that it looked like NIB. I've had it for less than a year.

Online RobD

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Re: GPR Lock Improvement
« Reply #39 on: November 02, 2016, 10:07:31 PM »
Quote from: "JStanley"
Quote from: "Rob DiStefano"
js - did you buy yer gun new or used?  if new, how long ago?

I traded for it - it was unfired though. When it arrived it looked like it had been sparked (dry fired) a few times but other than that it looked like NIB. I've had it for less than a year.

i guess there was no "return policy", with regards to the touch hole.  oh well.  sorry to hear this.

Offline JStanley

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Re: GPR Lock Improvement
« Reply #40 on: November 02, 2016, 11:02:42 PM »
All things considered and this being my first flinter, I am very happy with it and consider myself "hooked" on them for sure.

Online rollingb

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Re: GPR Lock Improvement
« Reply #41 on: November 02, 2016, 11:25:01 PM »
Quote from: "JStanley"
All things considered and this being my first flinter, I am very happy with it and consider myself "hooked" on them for sure.
And well you should be!  :)
I remember back in 1969, when I went to my first rendevous,.... we had about 60 shooters, and on the last day it came down to me and an older fella with a custom-built rifle being "tied". The shoot-off for 1st. place was, we were each to take 3 shots at a playing card at 100 yds. off-hand.
After firing,... we both walked down to get our cards, and he had 2 complete holes in his card PLUS a "notch" cut out of the edge of his card.
Me???????,... I had 3 complete holes in my card.  :hairy
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Offline Ohio Joe

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Re: GPR Lock Improvement
« Reply #42 on: November 03, 2016, 08:45:18 AM »
JStanley, I've been following this thread and your flash hole is located in the same exact place as mine. I've not had any problems with ignition whatsoever over the 10+ years years I've been shooting my Lyman GPR flintlock. You're good to go, and don't worry about it.

To those that may get the wrong idea from MountainDevil's post of buying items from, Midway USA, and Track of the Wolf,,, both companies do and always will stand behind what they sell. I've known Larry Potterfield from Midway for many years, and the good folks at Track even longer.

Bottom line, they can't fix what's wrong (if there is anything wrong) unless they know about it. And they would certainly rather know about it then to have this kind of undocumented hear-say floating around out here like it is in this thread.
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Offline JStanley

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Re: GPR Lock Improvement
« Reply #43 on: November 03, 2016, 12:03:32 PM »
I appreciate all the positive input on this subject.  Each of the things I've done to the lock thusfar to improve performance was cheap and easy and yielded positive results.  Like Ohio Joe said, this probably isn't anything I will ever try to correct in the machine shop, but it was fun to brainstorm on it!

Offline Muley

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Re: GPR Lock Improvement
« Reply #44 on: November 07, 2016, 01:31:48 PM »
I was hoping they'd get the LH version better. I just got the gun and I was right. The vent liner is centered in the pan. I'm not usually that lucky.
Pete
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