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Author Topic: Patched ball getting stuck too often.  (Read 3633 times)

Offline Smokey

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Patched ball getting stuck too often.
« on: January 02, 2021, 03:03:39 PM »
On at least two occasions, I have had to pack up early and extract a stuck ball. After two or three shots, the ball will not seat without using a range rod. Even then, it's a struggle.  It tends to hang up about midway down. If I get past that part, the ball still won't quite seat against the powder.  Again, I can get it seated if I switch to a heavy range rod. A .595 ball will roll down easily without a patch.

Is that normal?

.62 smoothbore.
.595 ball
For patching, I use either,
a). Ox-Yoke .60-69 Wonderlubed .010 patch, OR
b) scrap of linen lubed with mink oil.

I've tried swabbing before the first shot.
I've tried swabbing between shots.  A .590 ball isn't much better. 

Should I use smaller patches?
Maybe avoid patches altogether?

Thoughts? Wisdom?

Offline ridjrunr

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Re: Patched ball getting stuck too often.
« Reply #1 on: January 02, 2021, 05:11:01 PM »
What charge are you using?
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Offline Smokey

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Re: Patched ball getting stuck too often.
« Reply #2 on: January 02, 2021, 05:27:02 PM »
60 grains FFg.

Online Hank in WV

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Re: Patched ball getting stuck too often.
« Reply #3 on: January 02, 2021, 05:50:37 PM »
Have you tried a liquid lube?
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Offline Winter Hawk

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Re: Patched ball getting stuck too often.
« Reply #4 on: January 02, 2021, 06:46:35 PM »
Try no patch, but an over powder wad, felt wad and over shot wad, just as if you were using shot.  Of course you may then have to use a larger ball.  :bigsmile:

I expect the more experienced smoothbore shooters will chime in with their experience!

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Offline Ohio Joe

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Re: Patched ball getting stuck too often.
« Reply #5 on: January 02, 2021, 07:52:18 PM »
On at least two occasions, I have had to pack up early and extract a stuck ball. After two or three shots, the ball will not seat without using a range rod. Even then, it's a struggle.  It tends to hang up about midway down. If I get past that part, the ball still won't quite seat against the powder.  Again, I can get it seated if I switch to a heavy range rod. A .595 ball will roll down easily without a patch.

Is that normal?

.62 smoothbore.
.595 ball
For patching, I use either,
a). Ox-Yoke .60-69 Wonderlubed .010 patch, OR
b) scrap of linen lubed with mink oil.

I've tried swabbing before the first shot.
I've tried swabbing between shots.  A .590 ball isn't much better. 

Should I use smaller patches?
Maybe avoid patches altogether?

Thoughts? Wisdom?

.62 smoothbore.
.595 ball
For patching, I use either,
a). Ox-Yoke .60-69 Wonderlubed .010 patch, OR
b) scrap of linen lubed with mink oil.


Okay, lets do some math;

.620 bore

.595 Ball + .010 x 2 = .020 + .595 = (.615)


One would sure think that combination should work. If you can seat .590 ball with the same patch (that would give you (.610) -or- even go down to a .585 ball + .010 patch x 2 = .605... -or- .580 ball + .010 patch = .600 / or / .580 ball = .015 patch = .610...

Was this smoothbore used when you got it, or new? I ask, because perhaps if it were used - someone may not of maintained it very well...

Can you run a cleaning patch and feel any roughness in the bore in that area where the ball won't seat?

I also wonder if you got this used if someone might have used some "steel" shot in it instead of lead shot???

I also wonder if 99% of it is just fouling?
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Offline Smokey

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Re: Patched ball getting stuck too often.
« Reply #6 on: January 02, 2021, 08:30:51 PM »
Ohio Joe,
I bought the gun new and it's still somewhat new to me.  Fouling issue maybe?

Offline Ohio Joe

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Re: Patched ball getting stuck too often.
« Reply #7 on: January 02, 2021, 08:53:31 PM »
That very well could be...

I think the more you shoot it, the more it'll tell you.

I need to get out with my smoothbore once Spring rolls around... I don't believe I shot mine at all in 2020, but where I left off in 2019 was looking for that "tightest" patch & ball load I could reload easy enough shot after shot.

Good luck and have fun with it!  :hairy
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Offline Uncle Russ

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Re: Patched ball getting stuck too often.
« Reply #8 on: January 03, 2021, 04:40:27 AM »
FWIW:  I don't like the sound of that, "It tends to hang up about midway down".......
I have had guns where the PRB was hard as the devil start. and I have had guns where the PRB seemed to want to stop just before seating on the powder charge according to the witness mark on the Ram Rod..... and we all know that ain't good.
In both cases, it was fairly easily resolved by the Fire Lapping of 10 / 15 shots.

Don't get excited about "Fire Lapping", there ain't no big deal about doing it and the metal used in the manufacture of today's guns is almost bulletproof, pardon the pun.

Anyway, you have a couple of choices in how you'll be doing this.
You will need JB Bore Paste, and a small tube of Valve grinding Compound.
You can "Lap" with JB Bore Paste, or use plain old Valve grinding Compound, but actual Fire Lapping is my personal choice.
With Fire Lapping, You load your normal load of powder, I think you said you're using about 60gr FFg, then you make a paste with Valve Grinding Compound and Baby Oil and smear up a .010 patch real good, then you seat the ball and patch down on the powder, Put a cap on it and fire it off, you don't have to shoot at anything in particular, just shoot it! Wipe between shots as necessary and Repeat this for about 10 or so shots, and you will find, or better yet, you should "feel" it loading easier, and much much smoother.
When you've reached this point, after "Fire Lapping" you're not done yet, you then you take a one caliber smaller brass bore brush, in your case a .58 brass brush would be about right, you wrap the Brass Brush good and tight with 0000 Steel Wool to where you can just get it down the bore, then use your fingers to mash/imbed/saturate the steel wool with as much JB Bore Paste as possible, and start swabbing, and you keep on swabbing, and refreshing the JB Bore Cleaner.
You will need 100 strokes minimum, with 200 strokes being the preferred goal.....you want that bore "shiny as a new Nickle", and smooth as a Baby's behind!...all the way down.
Clover Brand Valve Grinding Compound from NAPA is about 280/300 Grit.
JB Bore Paste is about 1,000/1,200 Grit.
Just make sure you use the JB Last.....or, as many have done when they are afraid of damaging the bore somehow, just use the JB and spend the many hours of pushing and pulling on that Ram Rod necessary to get the job done....if you don't care for Fire Lapping that's fine, many don't.
Just be prepared for a lot of work if you choose to do it all by hand. It can be done, as it has been done for years.
Just don't believe those old wives' tales about how fragile the barrel of your gun is.
Today's technology provides us with the best barrels ever made. Period!
You ain't going to hurt your barrel by Fire Lapping!

Years ago, we did this same thing with Bon Ami Scrubbing Powder.
An old wives' tale has us afraid to use any other cleaner because we would do dreadful things to the bore of our guns!
Well, let me tell ya....my older guns survived Ajax, Bon Ami, and every other scrubbing agent back in the 60's and 70's....some of the guns we got back then from Dixie Gun Works, Log Cabin, Pecotenica River Guns, TOTW, just about all of 'em needed "something" to clean the mess out the barrels left behind by quality control if they even had a quality control back then....and some of the more knowledgeable amongst the shooters of that time came up with what I just gave you....it works.
BTW: We're 3 days into the year 2021, let's make this the year that we rid ourselves of all the old wive's tales that otherwise simply refuse to die.


Russ...



 

 
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Online rollingb

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Re: Patched ball getting stuck too often.
« Reply #9 on: January 03, 2021, 05:10:56 AM »
From the research I've done on the fur trade period,.... the most common way to load one's smooth bore, was to simply drop a powder charge down the bore, followed by a ball and "wadding". (specifically "blanket wadding" was mentioned)

Today, a few folks report good luck shooting "bare ball" loads (as described above),.... while the majority of modern shooters seem to favor "patched ball" loads.

When experimenting with bare ball loads, it's best to keep the ball size (somewhere) within 0.020" of the bore's actual size.

My main smooth bore measures .615,.... and favors a .600 "bare ball",.... and 80 grs. of Olde Eynsford FFFG.

80 grs. of FFFG might sound like a pretty hefty load, but it's not when shooting bare balls.  :bl th up

I haven't spent enough time (yet) figuring out what my other .62 smooth bores prefer,... but I'm hoping it'll be something similar.
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Offline Smokey

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An Update!
« Reply #10 on: January 03, 2021, 12:16:07 PM »
First, thanks to everyone for sharing suggestions. Today, I tried shooting without any patches, just 60 grains of FFg under a .595 ball. No stuck balls! Easy to load. The gun shot well too.


Online rollingb

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Re: An Update!
« Reply #11 on: January 03, 2021, 08:16:00 PM »
First, thanks to everyone for sharing suggestions. Today, I tried shooting without any patches, just 60 grains of FFg under a .595 ball. No stuck balls! Easy to load. The gun shot well too.
:hairy  :toast  :applaud

A round ball that isn't "spinning" will become unstable at lower velocities,.... so you may find yourself needing to increase your powder charge (a bit) for ranges beyond what you were shooting today.  :bl th up
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Offline Smokey

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Re: Patched ball getting stuck too often.
« Reply #12 on: January 04, 2021, 10:42:07 AM »
Thanks, Rollingb. You. may be right. At 25 yards, I hit my mark with 60 grains. At 50 yards, I will adjust the recipe as needed.


Offline Hanshi

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Re: Patched ball getting stuck too often.
« Reply #13 on: January 05, 2021, 04:59:32 PM »
Sounds to me like a possible rough spot that needs polishing out.
Young guys should hang out with old guys; old guys know stuff.

Online rollingb

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Re: Patched ball getting stuck too often.
« Reply #14 on: January 05, 2021, 05:21:35 PM »
Sounds to me like a possible rough spot that needs polishing out.

Running a tight fitting patch and jag down the bore should be able to detect any "rough spot".  :bl th up
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