Traditional Muzzleloading Association

Craftsmanship => Gun Building and Repair => Topic started by: melsdad on August 11, 2008, 06:39:44 AM

Title: In the white??
Post by: melsdad on August 11, 2008, 06:39:44 AM

Please define what "In the white" means for a kit gun.

Thanks
Brian

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Post by: Gambia on August 11, 2008, 06:45:33 AM

" in the white"
Most of the woodworking done, some finishing fitting needs done, but none of the metal is finished, bare naked, you will need to blue or brown or let plain, what ever your desire is.

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Post by: melsdad on August 11, 2008, 06:54:04 AM

Thanks Tim, I should have asked yesterday.

Title: Re: In the white??
Post by: jbullard1 on August 11, 2008, 09:23:14 AM

Quote from: "melsdad"

Please define what "In the white" means for a kit gun.

Thanks
Brian

Brian
It also means different things to different suppliers so ask lots of questions before you buy

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Post by: melsdad on August 11, 2008, 09:30:24 AM

Thanks a bunch for the information fellas.  

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Post by: Captchee on August 11, 2008, 09:39:09 AM

yep what steve and the others have said , it varies.
  The guns that I  do  for folks in the white  are inlet  and shaped to the point all that’s needed is   the finish sanding and work on the stock .
 I do no work on the metals, with the acceptation of  the brass . If it’s a casting I take it down so  all that’s left is  to put on a good polish .

 That being said , I have seen  so called in the white guns that folks have bough which amounted to  nothing more then a basic pre carve stock with the parts  fitted .
 Leaving all the rest for the customer to  do .

 A couple years back I saw a  piece that was purchase from a pretty respected  and well known maker , here in the NW . the price was  only a couple hundred less then a full completed piece .
 The fella who owned it was showing his new in the white gun off to others at an event .
I was simply appalled. If it had been me , I would have sent the whole thing back .
 The stock  had simply been ruff shaped .  Rasping left  showing .
 Parts were  left  in casting   and inlet as such  .
While everything was drilled and the rifle assembled , that’s all I could really say  that was done .
 I just had to shake my head and walk away .

So  as others said ask the person your buying it from  what level  they consider in the white . Sometimes its easier to just by the parts and do it  from the start yourself

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Post by: melsdad on August 11, 2008, 11:56:43 AM

Thanks Captchee, I plan on doing a scratch build in the future. I wanted to take this route first to try and get a little more familiar with building a rifle. I will be sure to ask lots of questions from the makers before purchasing the parts.

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Post by: BEAVERMAN on August 11, 2008, 12:21:18 PM

Brian, you have the skills and the patience to do a scratch build, GO FOR IT! jump in with both feet and bite off a big chunk, plenty of us here to help you along, have the barrel channel and RR groove and hole done by whomever you buy it from and do the rest yourself, besides half the fun of doing the build is all the inletting of parts!

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Post by: melsdad on August 11, 2008, 12:33:30 PM

Thanks for the kind words Jim. I may just do that. I am a little nervous about a scratch build, but I know with the help of the knowledgeable guys here I can pull it off.

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Post by: BEAVERMAN on August 11, 2008, 12:44:15 PM

Just dont buy a $200 + piece of wood on your first, get ahold of pecatonica and ask Dick for one of the seconds or blemished stocks, Ive seen several of these and their fine when finished, then asl lots of questions as you progress through the project

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Post by: jbullard1 on August 11, 2008, 12:55:38 PM

Quote from: "BEAVERMAN"

Just dont buy a $200 + piece of wood on your first,...........................................

What you mean Beaverman I bought a second that was almost 200 for my scratch build. Makes you very, very careful of where and how you cut on it  :toast
I know you can do it.
One mistake I made was not getting the lock angle exactly right with the barrel. And I had to drill my own ramrod hole   very nerve wracking

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Post by: BEAVERMAN on August 11, 2008, 01:13:48 PM

Dick has some blanks there that are less than $100.00, not much figure in the wood but enough to make it interesting.

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Post by: Minnesota Mike on August 11, 2008, 02:40:06 PM

Getting the inletting on an 'in the white' kit was the biggest benefit for me on what I've done.

Very easy to screw it up and then what do you do? So agree with your sense of caution.

Agree that we have a lot of helpful folks around here with extremely useful information - but holding up a piece of wood to computer screen to ask questions just doesn't seem to work very well . . . On the other hand if you live nearby one of these gents - buy a really nice dinner and go visit for a while.

If you were to try working a blank down to size and then do the inletting, I'd suggest getting a DVD/Video or go to a show and actually see how someone does it first. Watching someone actually using the tools and seeing how the woods reacts and the pieces coming off is a major eye opener.

Having said that - BEAV - who has these blanks that are cheap? I'm still considering how to do a bucket kid's rifle without putting a lot out of pocket and working from a second for the stock may fit the bill (bad pun - sorry).

r/
MM

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Post by: BEAVERMAN on August 11, 2008, 05:25:44 PM

Mike, Pecatonica Longrifles , give Dick greensides a call and tell him what your needing, ask about their seconds stock blanks, take a look at their web site also, I think Jason ans Jbullard have both used their second stocks on their last builds that where posted here.

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Post by: Captchee on August 11, 2008, 05:43:31 PM

i have gotten full stocks with 80 % figure and of hard wood from dic at pecatoncia for less the 70 bucks and that with barrel channel cut and RR drilled  as well as pre shaped . you just have to ask  and accept  worm holes mineral stain and some feather cracks in the butt. of which gets cut off anyway for a standard pull .
 the point is you have to ask . they dont advertize it .
 also dont ask for seconds , he doesnt sell seconds  but he does have stocks with blemishes  that he sells at a discount

Title: In the white??
Post by: jbullard1 on August 11, 2008, 11:15:05 PM

This is my $90.00 stock from Pecatonica, It has a feather crack in the buttplate area, If I didn't know where it is, it would be hard to find it. I just ask if he has anything with a wormhole or other blemish

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Post by: Gambia on August 12, 2008, 06:08:52 AM

Brian, I usually do not loan out my video's, however, since I know the kind of fellow you are..If you want to borrow my video of Hershel House building a rifle from scratch, you can. Let me know and I can drop it off at the park the next weekend you are up or the next shoot. It is worth a look.

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Post by: LRB on August 21, 2008, 06:00:45 PM

Melsdad, I would suggest a Chambers kit as a first build to anyone that has never done it. You would learn plenty from it, and at the same time minimize a screw up. His kits cost more than others, but they are well worth the extra cost. Every dimes worth more. There just is no substitute in the kit arena.