Views on the 40 caliber

[tg]

". But then again, if one starts shooting squirrels, he probably isn't going to see much in the way of deer. "

My experience has been that as soon as you shoot a squirrel a nice buck will step out of the brush..happened twice in one season ten years ago, same season I chose not to buy a general Elk tag and had a nice leagal spike stand 20 ft from me when I was deer hunting with a .40. Murphy was working his MoJo that year. the only saving grace was a nice fork horn buck that I took within 30 yds of my truck as I finished the hunt for the day and was loading my gear into the canopy.

[mark davidson]

I'm still struggling to see round balls without making a relative comparasin to other centerfire projectiles.  Even a big ole .54 cal. round ball is only 230 grains or about the same as a standard projectile for .45ACP which is pretty puny on the hunting scale.  I'm not saying I am right; just new and having a hard time warming up to the smaller lighter stuff.  I think my loaded down .62 would make a fine squirrel rifle! :-)  Anything under 300 grains of projectile weight just does not inspire much confidence from me for anything bigger than a coyote. A .40 is often in my area hailed as a fine "target" rifle but I really do not see anybody around here trying to hunt deer with one. I have killed a few deer with .22 long rifle but that does not make it a good choice.

[Mitch]

To all who have little to no "faith" in a .40roundball...Speculation is one thing-actual use/testing is a whole different game......if you've never shot a .40(and I don't mean once or twice), then all the "I don't think it's enough for---whatever--" is merely speculation/wondering...actually owning a .40 and shooting it a LOT is testing/actual use...I have more faith in USE than SPECULATIONS!!

[huntinguy]

I'm still struggling to see round balls without making a relative comparasin to other centerfire projectiles.  Even a big ole .54 cal. round ball is only 230 grains or about the same as a standard projectile for .45ACP which is pretty puny on the hunting scale.  I'm not saying I am right; just new and having a hard time warming up to the smaller lighter stuff.  I think my loaded down .62 would make a fine squirrel rifle! :-)  Anything under 300 grains of projectile weight just does not inspire much confidence from me for anything bigger than a coyote. A .40 is often in my area hailed as a fine "target" rifle but I really do not see anybody around here trying to hunt deer with one. I have killed a few deer with .22 long rifle but that does not make it a good choice.

Well, I had the same opinion until I saw a bull elk lifted off the ground by a 54 cal. 230 gr. round ball. Load was 100gr fff. Range was 50 yards. Ball hit a rib, split in half and made two quarter size projectiles.

I have seen two bulls dropped with a single 50. cal RB. Longest shot was 110 paces. Bull went down like a switch was turned off.

I think the key is soft lead.

I don't think I would have a problem with a 40. on our local black tail at 50 to 75 yards. Mulies on the west side... I would think 45 to be minimum, but they be twice as big.

[Loyalist Dave]

.54 cal. round ball is only 230 grains or about the same as a standard projectile for .45ACP

,  And a .25-06 is half the weight of the .45 ACP projectile, but will slam deer.  It's not the weight of the projectile alone, it's the weight and the velocity.  A baseball weighs 5 ounces or 2175 grains, but even a 95 MPH fastball would probably not kill a deer.  

According to a comparison of the GOEX data and the Hodgdon Reloading manual if you want equivalent modern metallic cartridges..,

The .54 round ball with 100 gr of 2Fg is equivalent to some handloads for a .35 Remington with a 220 grain projectile

The .50 round ball with 100 grains of 2Fg is equivalent to a 170 grain .30-30, with 80 grains of 2Fg is equivalent to a .38-55

The .45 round ball with 90 grainsof 3Fg  is equivalent to the 6.5 Carcano (see JFK assassination)

AND the .40 round ball with 60 grains of 3Fg out performs the .25-35 Remington, and is equivalent to the .30 carbine.  

The problem you get with such modern comparison is the bullets don't do the same as lead round ball, and not the same as lead alloy round ball..., the holes are bigger at the beginning in each case when using round ball, and the deformation is different too.

LD

[tg]

That was a good post Dave, one has to let go of the world of centerfire cartridge guns when getting into mL's and learn what the practical limitations for the caliber is that you are shooting, I have taken several nice deer with a .40 and watched even more walk by of stop broadside at 100yds, one must be disciplined and let the long shots go. it can be a very rewarding type of hunting if one can let go of all that has been learned about what is or is not a good caliber and start from scratch learning the dos and don'ts of the various calibers and powder loads.I would not hesitate to go after Elk with a .50 I would just not take 125yd shots, this is the type of thing the new learning curve will bring to a hunter who is learning the ways of the PRB and hunting.

[Minnesota Mike]

For punching paper, love the .40 cal. Have found that sometimes it lacks the umph to knock over heavy metal silhouttes or move a metal swinger on a woods walk.

r/
MM

[Mike R]

The .40 is an illegal rifle here in Lousyanna for ANY hunting, small or big game.  I had one--very accurate and very pretty, but gave it to my son up in Arkansas where it is legal.  I did not hunt with my .40, it being illegal here, so cannot really comment on its abilities except by way of comparison with other guns.   [by the way, you should compare MLing loads with modern pistol loads not rifle loads for the most part]  The little .395 pill does not contain much lead by weight and in my rifle was most accurate with relatively mild loads [40 gr fffg].  I would not deem it a deer rifle, but I know it CAN kill deer if the shot well-placed--so can a .22LR [a buddy of mine even killed a large doe with a .22CB with only 725 fps MV].  I have killed many squirrels [many many] over a lifetime of hunting [~60 yrs as a hunter] and my considered opinion is that anything over a .22LR or a .32 MLer is overkill.  Certainly you CAN kill a squirrel with a .40 or a .62--you can also do a very nasty job on one with a pick-up truck.  I prefer smaller calibers for small game--classic southern squirrel rifles ranged .30 to .38.  The .40 is a very fine varmint caliber and a fine target rifle...

[nessy357]

I wanted to do some  muzzleloading penetration  comparisons , so I taped up some cataloques and shot them at 75yds.
2 shots with my 40 cal 50 grs FFG
1 shot with my 62 cal   80 grs FFg







All 3 shots penetrated pretty much the same distance, approx 3 "
Biggest difference being the massive "bruise" the 62 left.

[tg]

"Live simply. Love generously. Care deeply. Speak kindly. Leave the rest Up to God. "

 Good way to live, ya just forgot the part about shootin' them all now...

[rickevans]

I read "cataloques"  at cantalopes and was expecting to see dead fruit and seeds everywhere.

[Roaddog]

That was a good test Nessy. Do you use FF all the time with the 40? My 40 likes FFF goxe and 35 grins for the best acrit shot. Or were just going fot the penetration?

[nessy357]

Whoops ,that should have read 50grs of FFFg   normally i use 40 grs of FFFg , I thought I would bump it up to simulate a hunting load.
Cheers Bob.

[flintlock62]

It works fine on Deer if you get close as in archery hunting, I also found it to be OK for squirrels if you are going to head shoot of hit the middle there will be little difference between the .40 and .36

I agree with that statement.  If one doesn't "bark" shoot a squirrel with a .36 or .40, it doesn't really matter.  I, too have seen deer dropped at 50 yards.  Good placed shots on deer with a small caliber does matter more than larger calibers though.

[flintlock62]

I read a lot of the posts here, and I'm only a guest, but why is there so much discussion of centerfire vs. muzzleloading round balls on this thread?