Traditional Muzzleloading Association
Traditional Firearms => Flintlock Long Guns => Topic started by: Stormrider51 on September 13, 2022, 07:55:19 PM
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I don't spend much time on online gun auction sites. I'm a lefty and all I'm really interested in are flinters and that combination is fairly rare. I do look occasionally and the other day I came across something that caught my eye. It was a lefty southern mountain rifle with a fancy tiger maple stock and featuring a patch box. It also has a set of Lyman target sights which to me look a bit out of place. Somebody's target rifle? The seller admitted to knowing very little about the rifle or guns in general and stated that it had been hanging on a wall for years. He said it might have some rust and pitting in the bore although he doesn't have a bore scope to check. The barrel is 3/4" across the flats and 44" long. This was the first time I've ever had anyone describe a guns caliber as 'a 5/16"drill bit will fit in the bore'. A little math told me that it was probably .32 cal. The name of the probable maker, D. Motto, is engraved neatly on a flat near the breech. No other markings. A little online research revealed a well-respected rifle maker named Dave Motto from West Virginia.
Well, I placed a bid and almost hoped someone would out-bid me. I won it. When it arrived I set about unpacking my new possession with more than a bit of apprehension. Everything looked great externally but if the bore was toast I was the owner of an expensive wall-hanger. Swabbing the bore revealed some light rust but I didn't feel any rough places. I removed the lock and found DM stamped inside the plate. Did Motto make his own locks? Next I removed the barrel from the stock and was delighted to discover it was stamped "Getz" and a serial number. My day was looking up! Even if the bore was too damaged to deliver good accuracy I can still have it bored out and rifled to a larger caliber. Then there was the Mystery Screw. On the top-right flat is a round-headed slotted screw. That's a first for me. I gingerly attempted to remove it but it seems perfectly happy where it was and I saw no reason to remove it.
That bit about not needing to remove the screw lasted until I took the rifle to the range for its debut. A friend was there and we were chatting about the rifle. I'm sure you have already guessed what happened next. I dry-balled it. Well, my guess is that the MS is intended as a handy way to dribble in some powder in just such a situation. Unfortunately, that screw really likes being where it is! After marring the screw slightly I gave up and used the good old fashioned dribble through the touch hole.
So here's my question. Has anybody seen a set up like this? It's not necessary and frankly sort of like a wart on a pretty girl.
John
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That is certainly a first for me. Do you know if that hole goes all the way to the bore? As far as the lock goes, I'd guess Motto doesn't make his own locks. Probably assembles Chambers lock kits or is an assembler for Chambers. Other than the sites, that looks to be a purdy rifle.
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The sights do look a little "different" for such a pretty gun. If the mystery screw goes all the way into the bore, I think you have hit the nail on the head. If not, who knows? Maybe a filler for some other sighting arrangement? Anyway, I think you scored a beautiful piece there. If the bore pans out all the better!
~Kees~
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The only thing I can come up with is that the builder drilled the vent hole before installing the breech plug (where he thought it would be; and it didn't line up like he thought it would...) So, he tapped that hole and installed a screw for a plug / and then installed the breech-plug and vent (if it has a vent liner) in the proper place. [Just a speculation]
Personally, I would file the head of that screw flush to the barrel flat and move on. :shake
If you could get a bore camera down the barrel to take a look at that screw - that would be even better before doing anything with it.
I simply can't imagine it would be a breech plug locking screw / but stranger thinks have happened... It also may have been intended as a second "vent" hole for escaping gasses to control the breech area of less fouling... Probably didn't work so it got plugged. It's amazing what serious target shooters will try...
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Thanks for the answers, guys. One thing I didn't mention is that the barrel doesn't have a dovetail for a rear sight. So it was set up with the target sights from the beginning. The whole rifle is so well executed that the darned extra screw really has me scratching my head. Bottom line is that I'll probably never know.
The globe front sight has a circular insert that would work well with a round bullseye target. Unfortunately, I only have targets with the orange diamonds so I couldn't do much in the way of checking accuracy at the range last Monday. I ordered a set of inserts that will include a standard post and plan to be back at the range on Monday. Then I can start working on the best load.
John
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Well, after seeing this picture / that may have very well been a sight base screw. You'll have to scroll through the picture to around the nose cap & barrel;
(https://i.imgur.com/lEwn0hr.jpg?2)
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The only thing I can come up with is that the builder drilled the vent hole before installing the breech plug (where he thought it would be; and it didn't line up like he thought it would...) So, he tapped that hole and installed a screw for a plug / and then installed the breech-plug and vent (if it has a vent liner) in the proper place. [Just a speculation]
Considering how the screw lines up with the pan, I think you got it, Joe. The builder just turned the barrel so the hole is out of the way of a new vent and installed the breech plug like it is now.
Again considering where the screw is in relation to the pan, I don't think it was for the rear sight. The way it was built the rear peep sight must have already been in the plan, mounted on the tang.
~Kees~[/size]
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I was drilling a pilot vent hole before I drilled to the final size, I thought I would feel the bit hit the inside of the barrel but I didn't. The next thing I knew was I had drilled in one side of the barrel and out the other side. I taped the errant hole for a screw, put red Loctite on the screw and proceeded to plug the extra hole. I checked with Zonie on the M/L Forum about my screw combination and safety, he did the math and said my screw plug was safe to 10 times the pressure generated by shooting the gun. I dressed the screw down and made it disappear with browning.
Your screw may be held in place by red Loctite, it will release of you heat it but will not tun out by any normal means without being heated first.
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Good Info, Eric!!! Zonie, over on the M/L Forum has a lot of knowledge, that's for sure. :bl th up
Kees, IMHO - this being a Flintlock, breech pressure is reduced through the vent-hole on ignition, so to be on the safe side, I would just "dress" that screwhead slot / brown it, and enjoy that rifle rather than trying to extract that screw. :shake
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so to be on the safe side, I would just "dress" that screwhead slot / brown it, and enjoy that rifle rather than trying to extract that screw. :shake
I would want to make sure it didn't protrude into the chamber first, but otherwise something like Eric did would be perfectly acceptable to me....
~Kees~
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Being that the rifle is already a beauty the bore should be at least decent; if not just have it freshened. I agree that the screw should be filed flush and browned so it will pretty much disappear. If it were me, and it's not, I'd file a dovetail and insert a traditional sight.