Shooting Traditional Firearms and Weapons > General Interest

Paper Patching for Muzzleloading Rifles

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Maven:
You can find lots of information on the Cast Boolits site, specifically the BP Paper Patching sub-forum, on paper patching.  The sticky, Paper 101 (3rd from the top) ia very informative, as is Buckshot's (Rick Tunell) short post on sources of paper suitable for paper patching (below):

Strathmore: 300 Series Tracing paper. 25 lb .0016"

Mead: #54200, tracing paper. No weight listed, .0017"

Office Depot brand: item 345854. Vellum, 16 lb. 100% cotton, white translucent paper, .0025"

Staedtler: Bought at Office Depot. Vellum, 25% cotton .0027"

Mead: # 38102 Medium weight, erasable bond typing paper. .0028"

RobD:
for me and my muzzleloaders, i prefer to emulate the mid 18th century, so it's flintlock replicas and patched balls for long gun barrel innards that are twisted or smooth.  however, i only load and shoot patched slicks (aka "PPBs" or "paper patched bullets") for late 19th century cartridge rifle replicas; sharps and rollers.  the concepts and practices are identical in every respect for each discipline with regards to the projectile build and proper fouling control.  some mighty fine really long range shooting (800, 900 and 1000 yards) has been accomplished with percussion muzzleloaders firing patched slicks ... and PPBs offer no leading, to boot.  if supreme accuracy was my goal with a muzzleloader, it'd be absolutely found with a gibbs percussion in .45 caliber.

Idaholewis:

--- Quote from: Maven on September 26, 2019, 06:52:50 PM ---You can find lots of information on the Cast Boolits site, specifically the BP Paper Patching sub-forum, on paper patching.  The sticky, Paper 101 (3rd from the top) ia very informative, as is Buckshot's (Rick Tunell) short post on sources of paper suitable for paper patching (below):

Strathmore: 300 Series Tracing paper. 25 lb .0016"

Mead: #54200, tracing paper. No weight listed, .0017"

Office Depot brand: item 345854. Vellum, 16 lb. 100% cotton, white translucent paper, .0025"

Staedtler: Bought at Office Depot. Vellum, 25% cotton .0027"

Mead: # 38102 Medium weight, erasable bond typing paper. .0028"



--- End quote ---

Good info on the Paper Maven  :bl th up

 I put this up for those don’t do the Castboolit Thing anymore  :) (Myself Being one of them)

 I am friends with Rick Tunell (Buckshot) I have several Custom sizers from Rick, He and i just put about an Hour in on the Phone Recently, Rick is a SOLID, Honest Guy  :bl th up

RobD:
i've been using papermill fidelity onion with good BPCR results, and that'd be worth a try for patching muzzy bullets.  PM me yer address and i'll send you some to cut up and test.

please bear with me a bit, i'm gonna talk BPCR but there is a correlation to PPB (paper patched bullet) muzzys.  the absolute KEY to paper patching is the fit of the combined diameter of bullet and patching, and the fit of the resulting PPB in the chamber.  changing the patching thickness can make a big difference.  with BPCR, almost everyone is using a bore rider with an easy slip fit of the PPB into the chamber.  a proper PPB bore rider cartridge will have the PPB sitting inside the case 1/10" (no, that's not a typo).  the next question is, what chamber?  if it's a custom PPB chamber with little to nearly zero freebore, the bullet's base will have a minimal obturate squeeze into the rifling.  if it's a greaser chamber, with some (to a lot) of freebore, there will be lots more of the PPB to expand in the freebore area and then get squished down to meet both the bore/lands and grooves.  the great thing is that NONE of this is a problem with a muzzleloader since the "chamber" is the bore and grooves. 

SO, i would expect that a loose fitting (bore rider) patched bullet down the gullet of a muzzy barrel would have excellent expansion (obturation) with none of the issues associated with a cartridge PPB.  in order for ANY of this to work well for both muzzy and cartridge guns, the bore MUST be wiped between shots.  failure to do a good bore wipe will absolutely mean loss of consistent accuracy.  in the BPCR world we use home made "gophers" made with nylon bristled cleaning brushes, VFG felts, and neoprene squeegee "O" rings.  this pushes the considerable bp residue out the tube from the chamber end in ONE pass of a gopher that's been backed with a clean/dry patch.  no question it will take a LOT more effort/work to reasonably clean out a muzzy barrel! 

Idaholewis:

--- Quote from: RobD on October 03, 2019, 05:26:14 PM ---i've been using papermill fidelity onion with good BPCR results, and that'd be worth a try for patching muzzy bullets.  PM me yer address and i'll send you some to cut up and test.

please bear with me a bit, i'm gonna talk BPCR but there is a correlation to PPB (paper patched bullet) muzzys.  the absolute KEY to paper patching is the fit of the combined diameter of bullet and patching, and the fit of the resulting PPB in the chamber.  changing the patching thickness can make a big difference.  with BPCR, almost everyone is using a bore rider with an easy slip fit of the PPB into the chamber.  a proper PPB bore rider cartridge will have the PPB sitting inside the case 1/10" (no, that's not a typo).  the next question is, what chamber?  if it's a custom PPB chamber with little to nearly zero freebore, the bullet's base will have a minimal obturate squeeze into the rifling.  if it's a greaser chamber, with some (to a lot) of freebore, there will be lots more of the PPB to expand in the freebore area and then get squished down to meet both the bore/lands and grooves.  the great thing is that NONE of this is a problem with a muzzleloader since the "chamber" is the bore and grooves. 

SO, i would expect that a loose fitting (bore rider) patched bullet down the gullet of a muzzy barrel would have excellent expansion (obturation) with none of the issues associated with a cartridge PPB.  in order for ANY of this to work well for both muzzy and cartridge guns, the bore MUST be wiped between shots.  failure to do a good bore wipe will absolutely mean loss of consistent accuracy.  in the BPCR world we use home made "gophers" made with nylon bristled cleaning brushes, VFG felts, and neoprene squeegee "O" rings.  this pushes the considerable bp residue out the tube from the chamber end in ONE pass of a gopher that's been backed with a clean/dry patch.  no question it will take a LOT more effort/work to reasonably clean out a muzzy barrel!

--- End quote ---

Rob, i would LOVE a Sheet of that Paper to Try! Thank you for the Generous offer! I have some Old 9# Onion Skin 25% Cotton Stuff, it measures just a little Shy of .002 Single, 2 Wraps will bring a .442 Diameter Bullet up to .449, Which i have found to be ideal in a .450-.451 Bore. I have Paper Patch Bullets that Range from .442, to .444 in Diameter. I have every size of Sizer I could possibly use. If i had it to do over I would have bought a Swinglock, or a Hankins adjustable Sizing Die Instead of 10 Lee’s  :)

I have been tinkering with Paper Patch in Muzzleloaders from my Very Beginning in this Stuff, it is actually what got me interested in Muzzleloaders. I have had Several Custom Bullet molds made for it. You might have read Ron’s Stuff (Idahoron) on Paper Patching? It is on CB in the Muzzleloader Section, they made it a Sticky for him, That is actually what got me interested, But after playing around with it some, and Speaking to guy’s like Dave Gullo, And Lee Shaver’s I QUICKLY Gave up on Ron’s Method and went a different Route.

 The Main difference with me and Ron is the Bullet Diameter from the Mold. For .50 Cal Ron uses a Lee S&W 500 Bullet, that Bullet Drops from the Mold at around .502, He then Wraps his 9# onion Skin Paper (2 Wraps, which would bring his Bullet up to .508-.510 Depending on Paper thickness of course) They are then Forced Through a .501 Sizing Die. I tried it in my VERY Beginning, i had problems with it, (I got Bullets stuck in my sizer Die from my Lead being a bit to Hard at 9-9.5 BHN, And Papers sticking to the Bullets in Flight, The Paper is WELDED on after being Sized)
      For .50 Cal PP Muzzleloader i use a .492-.494 Diameter Bullet, Depending on Bore Diameter and Paper thickness? What I am doing, is Patching “UP TO BORE” My Patched Bullets DON’T Need Sized, Worse case scenario If i have a TIGHT Fit, i will run them through a Sizer that is .001 under, All this does is “Iron” the Paper and Makes for easier Loading.

 It wasn’t long after i got going, i was over at Buffalo Arms picking up supplies, i had a Box of Their .442 and .444 Diameter Cupped Base Swaged PP Slicks, Dave Gullo (BACO Owner) Asked me what i was doing with them? I explained it to him, He IMMEDIATELY said “You are wiping between Shots”  ;D I said YEP! With Real Blackpowder you simply have to, I tried to reload a Swiss 2F Fouled bore, Trying to Mimic a Hunting/Reload Situation, I could NOT get that Patched Bullet Down the Bore Without Stripping the Paper, Wiping Between Shots is an ABSOLUTE Must with Real Blackpowder.

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