Traditional Muzzleloading Association

Craftsmanship => Gun Building and Repair => Topic started by: Hood on June 21, 2010, 09:44:56 AM

Title: How to brown a barrel?
Post by: Hood on June 21, 2010, 09:44:56 AM

What is the best way to brown a barrel?

I appreciate any help/comments.

Thanks!

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Post by: Riley/MN on June 21, 2010, 11:30:40 AM

Get a bottle of Wahkon Bay Tru-brown and follow the instructions that come with it.

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Post by: Hood on June 21, 2010, 01:57:44 PM

Thanks for the information.

I see that there are a lot of choices out there. Are they all about the same? Where can I find Wahkon Bay Tru-brown?

In opinions on Dixie's Browning Solution or Birchwood Casey Plum Brown?

Thanks!

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Post by: Riley/MN on June 21, 2010, 02:59:32 PM

Here is a page with Wahkon Bay products, as well as others: http://muzzleloaderbuilderssupply.com/c ... n-Finishes (http://muzzleloaderbuilderssupply.com/cgi-bin/mbscart/agora.cgi?product=Gun-Finishes)

I guess I can't speak to the other finishes. My family is good friends with the founder/orig. owner of Wahkon Bay Outfitters, and as such I have not needed to try anything else.... I have browned just two barrels and a handful of other pieces though, so although mine was the first answer-there are a whole lot more folks on this board with a whole lot more knowledge in this area than this here child...

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Post by: Loyalist Dave on June 21, 2010, 05:36:53 PM

A lot of modern builders just slap on the browning solution to the factory finished rifle.  Depending on the time period of the gun, the barrel really should be polished first, then browned as it was done in the past.  The finish is much smoother, and I think an obvious difference.  Especially when browning a lock to match and the lock has cast parts.  They really need to be polished first to knock off the casting texture.  The Wahkon Bay stuff works very well indeed.  

LD

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Post by: Osprey on June 21, 2010, 06:31:12 PM

I've used Laurel Mt Forge (LMF) cold brown on all mine so far, great results.  Draw file, then sand to 220 grit, then follow the instructions on the bottle.  One thing extra I do is degrease the barrel first with carb cleaner.  I know the LMF says it degreases on its own, but why chance it?  Normally takes me 5-6 coats of cold brown for a good finish.  To get the humidity high enough I do a load of towels and jeans in the washer, then hang them in my furnace room to dry.  Gets positively sauna like in there, perfect for browning barrels and locks.

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Post by: Captchee on June 22, 2010, 09:38:21 AM

There are as many ways to brown  a barrel as there are stars in the sky . Some ways can produce like colors . Yet others produce something  completely different . As such you can end up with a color any where from deep chocolate brown to  light brown to purple reds .
 Some products that are out there ,  are really nothing more then a  coating  that rides on the surface . Others are Oxide stimulants  and  produce a brown that grabs onto the barrel  when done properly  . A true brown is nothing but Rust “Iron oxide “
 There are basicly two types of brown . Hot brown and cold brown
 Below is my process for cold browning
 
  Personally, I  no longer buy  solutions . But LM is about the best out there IMO if your going to buy something  .
 Now that being said . LM is not what it used to be .
 Here is how I do  a browned barrel
  1) draw file the barrel
2) come back  with a solid block and  paper down to  200-300 grit . . I don’t polish ..  If 300 grit is good enough for the likes of Greener , Parker and such ,,, well enough said
3)   I degrease the barrel .  In this process  I wear cotton gloves  and from then on tell the barrel is done , it will never be touched with   bare hands  even when carding .
 Now you will read where some companies state rubber gloves .   Myself I  have came to the conclusion that this practice is what  many times leaves spots on the barrel .
4) now comes the part where one can put on a product like LM  or one the make themselves . If you plan on  doing lots of rifles then make up a solution is the way to go . it’s a nasty job and you must be carful . But once made , you will have enough to last most of a lifetime

5)  the barrels go into a humidity box . Now this box isn’t needed but it does speed things up . With the box you can double the amount of cardings you can do in a day  over just setting the barrels out side. that’s with or without a oxide stimulant  .  If you live in an area of low humidity like I do . A simple, cheep  sweat box  is a great help
6) after  an hour or two in the box  the barrels will be coated with a  good coat of rust .
 NOTE; keep an eye on things because you don’t want the barrels   to grow fur .

 the barrels are then removed “again with cotton gloves . They are then  washed and lightly carded back  with either denim or burlap  under cold water . What carding does is remove the heavy scale .  You don’t want to  scrub the barrels . Just  use enough pressure  to  start to lighten the brown .

7) the barrels are put back in the  sweat box and  the process starts again . Normally 5 to 7 cycles will produce a  very even , smooth  brown that looks as if you have polished the barrels . When in fact you have not

 A Note on polishing here . You can actually polish  to the point that you will pay the devil to get  the rust to grow. You also can come out with an un even job .  On top of that , the rust you can start to get  is a staining rust . Staining rust  can be a bugger to remove  and many time even when removed will still produce a darker area .

once a barrel has a good even color  I  wash the barrel down with a  whitening made from backing soda . This  neutralizes any of the acids from  solutions.. I then coat the barrel with oil .  For oil I use  I of two types depending on the color I want  . Simple 90 W  or Trany fluid   . If you use trany fluid it must be the non detergent kind .
90W will give you a solid and sometimes dark brown . Trany will give that brown a read tint .” See  the under hammer I did for Chair slayer a couple years back that  he posted photos of , here on  the TMA .

 The  barrel is kept  washed  in oil and not allowed to dry for a minimum of 24 hours . After that , simple wipe the barrel down , removing any excesses oil .

 Now for a hot brown  I use simple household  bleach ‘Clorox’
WARNING : do this in a well ventilated area  and wear gloves . Hot bleach can give you very bad chemical burns

 Using a clean heat source “IE propane torch” I  heat the barrel to the point water will sizzle . No need to de grease unles  the barrel is  coated in oil or grease  as the heat will boil off most any light oils like from your hands and such .
 using a clean rag I wipe on the   bleach .  You will see the barrel turn brown then a yellow to white coating will cover the brown .  Keep your rag soaked and dripping in bleach  and continue on down the barrel . Once the complete barrel is coated , I then card  the barrel . Then  re heat and apply the  bleach again . Normally it take 3 to for cycles and you will have a very strong and even brown  that a medium chocolate color .
Again with this .  Carding is what makes the rust smooth .  The process of carding removes the heavy scale and leaves only the fine  small scale


anyway , hope that helps some

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Post by: Osprey on June 22, 2010, 09:46:00 AM

I like that tip about the 90w/tranny fluid for brown vs red color, have to play with that one.  One of the guys I build with has been dying to get the purplish color on his barrels, I'll pass the info along.  I've used Breakfree and gotten a nice chocolate color.

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Post by: Bigsmoke on June 22, 2010, 10:47:06 AM

This web site give a lot of formulas for browning and bluing and such.

http://www.sciencecompany.com/patinas/p ... rmulas.htm (http://www.sciencecompany.com/patinas/patinaformulas.htm)

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Post by: Captchee on June 22, 2010, 12:57:20 PM

Quote from: "Osprey"

I like that tip about the 90w/tranny fluid for brown vs red color, have to play with that one.  One of the guys I build with has been dying to get the purplish color on his barrels, I'll pass the info along.  I've used Breakfree and gotten a nice chocolate color.

 the purple  red color comes from a given formula . not from the oils used

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Post by: nessy357 on June 23, 2010, 03:22:59 AM

I've had a lot of success with LMF, omly thing I do different is, after I neutralise the barrel with baking soda.Dry it off , and hand rub in Tung oil, very little need to be applied. Seals the barrel and leaves it with a very light satin finish.
Cheers Bob

Title: with a Hot Brown
Post by: mike rumping on June 23, 2010, 07:20:28 PM

One thing about hot brown though, if you've a barrel to brown with a soldered rib on it, do NOT heat it too much or you might let the solder melt, and have to redo it.   :cry:  
Mike

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Post by: Captchee on June 23, 2010, 07:56:24 PM

no need to get it that hot mike . but you are right . if you do , you got an issue

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Post by: Uncle Russ on June 23, 2010, 09:29:23 PM

I gotta agree with Captchee on LMF and a "Sweat-Box"

Here is my old Sweat Box....on the floor of the box I set a coffee can full of hot water, with a sponge floating on top, turn on the Heat Lamp, and close the door.
I can card as many 3 times in a day, and sometimes even more if I am real excited about some project.

If you look at the parts real close at the picture, you can a nice patina taking place after only a few hours.
(some folks use a single burner hot-plate to keep the water boiling as a catalyst, but I just change out my water a couple of times and that seems to suffice.)

[albumimg:fmhadcey]2219[/albumimg:fmhadcey]
[size=67]click to enlarge[/size]

Uncle Russ...

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Post by: Captchee on June 23, 2010, 10:37:54 PM

looks just like mine Russ .
 cost leas the 20 bucks to build .
 small electric  coffee pot  from the  church 2nd hand store .
 4 , 6ft 1 and 12 pine and a  5 .00 shop light from  HD
only diffrence i can see is i have an adjustable baffle in mine  that sets just above the coffee pot .
 i can do 1 cycle every  2 hours