Traditional Muzzleloading Association

Shooting Traditional Firearms and Weapons => General Interest => Topic started by: Swamp on November 23, 2010, 01:51:10 PM

Title: Trigger Job?????
Post by: Swamp on November 23, 2010, 01:51:10 PM
Can anyone tell me the correct procedure for lightening a trigger on (in this case) a Tulle? After looking at the backside of the lock, it would seem to me that the tumber would need to be filed down slightly to lessen the contact between itself and the sear? Is this correct? I need to lighten my trigger, as it's just way to heavy. Thanks a bunch!  :shake
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Post by: Sir Michael on November 23, 2010, 02:47:08 PM
You can file on the tumbler and possibly on the sear but that is a tricky business.  

You might want to try filing on the side of the sear spring or otherwise reducing the tension in it.  Again this is a tricky business but of far less consequence than screwing up the tumbler.  (springs are easier to replace than tumblers)

Also there is the trigger.  For this I'd recommend that you pull the trigger and evaluate its design.  The easiest and best way to lighten the trigger pull is change the geometry of the trigger/sear relationship.  If you can move the pivot point of the trigger up and for or aft so that it is closer to the point where the top of it meets the sear bar.  The goal is to get the maximum leverage on the sear bar hence a lower pressure to move it and fire the pistol.

I almost forgot.  Before you do anything examine the lock and trigger works.  remove any burrs that are rubbing on any other part and polish to a mirror finish [size=150]all [/size]surfaces that have to rub on another (main spring/lock plate, main spring/tumbler, sear/tumbler, tumbler/lock plate, tumbler/bridle, sear bar/trigger bar, trigger pivot hole/pivot bar, trigger sides/whatever they ride on).  Once you have done all this and put it back together determine if you need to do more then pick your poison so to speak.
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Post by: rickevans on November 23, 2010, 03:38:20 PM
I cannot second Sir Michael's advice more strongly:
"Before you do anything examine the lock and trigger works. remove any burrs that are rubbing on any other part and polish to a mirror finish all surfaces that have to rub on another (main spring/lock plate, main spring/tumbler, sear/tumbler, tumbler/lock plate, tumbler/bridle, sear bar/trigger bar, trigger pivot hole/pivot bar, trigger sides/whatever they ride on). Once you have done all this and put it back together determine if you need to do more then pick your poison so to speak."

Many, many times I have been able to take a horrendous trigger to more than acceptable just by polishing and honing the surfaces. Get some good polishing stones and water or light oil.
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Post by: Loyalist Dave on November 23, 2010, 03:50:56 PM
Yes indeed a good polishing, by hand, again by hand, with proper stones, and you will probably see a remarkable difference!  It's amazing, and also amazing how little when done improperly with a power tool or aggressive file will really FUBAR the whole works..., personal experience!  

LD
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Post by: Hank in WV on November 23, 2010, 05:19:42 PM
Unless you absolutely know what you're doing, don't change the angles on the tumbler or sear nose. This could make it very dangerous.
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Post by: Buzzard on November 23, 2010, 07:17:23 PM
It's been my experience, tumblers and sears cannot be filed at all. They're simply to hard. They are a stone only job. And yes, that's where you start. Failing that, I've had my best luck reducing sear spring pressure. Good Luck and stay in touch!
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Post by: Captchee on November 23, 2010, 07:44:09 PM
Swamp ,
A properly set up single trigger should be very nice in its pull . With little  to no creep as well as sharp in the action .
 But it has to be set up that way . No amount of filing is going to change a badly  placed trigger .
Sir Michael
 Has it pretty much right  on the trigger part .
 Myself I don’t often mess with  filing springs . The reason being is that no mater how light you make the sear spring , if the full cock notch is to steep  your going to have to still over come  the weight of the mainspring   by applying undo leverage with your finger to the trigger.  
  When it comes to filing , you need to know what your doing or you can actually end up with something that either will not work at all , will stop working  down the road , or  be unsafe

  I would submit that  more info is needed .
 Who made your Tulle
 what lock is in your tulle ?
 From there   better advise can be given as to what to doas far as work on the lock

 If you have a quality lock , IMO your problem is more likely to be a case of the trigger itself is not set right .
 Single triggers are a mater of leverage as Sir Michael stated . If you measure from the pivot to where the trigger bar contacts the sear arm . That distance should be    just under ½ the  distance  from the pivot to where your  finger sets .
 The trigger should also be set high enough that  pressure from the trigger pushes on the sear at the same angle as the  arch of the sear on its pivot.
IE not strait up but  back and slightly up
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Post by: Sir Michael on November 24, 2010, 01:00:54 PM
Thanks for the trigger setup info.  I couldn't find that information when I made my post so I was working from memory.

I added that information about lightening the sear spring only because a local gun maker of renown told me that over the last few years he has been seeing a lot of sear springs that were way to stiff (lawyers again I think).
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Post by: Loyalist Dave on November 26, 2010, 10:20:57 AM
Quote
(lawyers again I think).

Shakespear was right!  :clap
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Post by: LRB on November 29, 2010, 05:44:17 PM
Do not lower the tumbler notch. That could cause the sear to strike the safety notch when you fire the gun, unless you have a fly in the tumbler. Even then, bad idea, because the fly can cause a hang up then. First lighten the sear spring. It only needs enough strength to return the sear in a safe and positive mode. Check your progress using the safety notch. Using 60/40 lead solder, solder a small steel plate behind the tumbler notch,  that is thick enough to be roughly even with the top edge of the notch. leave a small gap between the notch face and the plate. Then file the plate down until the full face of the sear will engage the notch. No more than that. Do this proceedure after polishing everything that moves against another surface, and polish that surface. That will give you a very good trigger pull as long as angles were correct to start with. 98% of sear springs are way over powered, most need only a third of that power, and often less. If you find the trigger to light to control afterwards, then file a little more off the plate. The nice thing about the plate, is that it can always be removed, leaving things just as they were. The 60/40 solder flows at 375° and that heat will not affect the tumblers heat treat if you are careful to not over heat when you solder. If you are not good at soldering, use J&B WELD to secure the plate. Using this method, will usually bring any trigger down to a very nice pull, as long as contact angles are reasonably correct. I can normally bring double lever set triggers down to 2lbs, when unset,  by doing this.