Traditional Muzzleloading Association

Shooting Traditional Firearms and Weapons => General Interest => Topic started by: shootrj2003 on December 06, 2010, 11:43:13 AM

Title: oak ramrod
Post by: shootrj2003 on December 06, 2010, 11:43:13 AM
I found in Lowes and probably Home Depot,separate from the regular dowels, where the stair ballisters and such are they have oak dowels,long enough for Hawkins/plains rifles,about 1.00,not quite a flexible as hickory mind you but a dang sight better than the normal ''hardwood'' /poplar ones in the regular dowels I found a good number were nice straight grain wood not likely to break.for some reason there were no 5/16'' [.36] and they are'nt quite long enough for my BlueRidge longrifle but the shorter guns they would fit.
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Post by: pathfinder on December 06, 2010, 03:56:59 PM
They WILL split and go through your hand,not a matter of if,it's a matter of WHEN! There's a reason you don't find them in original guns, THEY WILL HURT YOU! Just because you can,doesn't mean you should. I hate to sound a little harsh,but we need everyone to be safe and unharmed in our sport. The anti's are always lookin for a reason to kill the sport.
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Post by: Firewalker on December 06, 2010, 04:41:48 PM
Quote from: "pathfinder"
They WILL split and go through your hand,not a matter of if,it's a matter of WHEN! There's a reason you don't find them in original guns, THEY WILL HURT YOU! Just because you can,doesn't mean you should. I hate to sound a little harsh,but we need everyone to be safe and unharmed in our sport. The anti's are always lookin for a reason to kill the sport.

Ditto that.

I've seen a few rods split over the years. It can put a big damper on your shooting or hunting day.
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Post by: shootrj2003 on December 06, 2010, 10:09:34 PM
I have split a couple myself ,the ones that came with the gun are long gone to splits ville I reacon if you use one long enough it will probably let go. You CAN  choose the grain to be as straight as possible so that it doesn't run at a diagonal and off the side of the rod and you have to look at it visually with your eyes to see that.thank you for the info it pays to be careful!
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Post by: Kermit on December 06, 2010, 10:59:39 PM
I saw a split ramrod go right through a mate's hand! Don't do it. Not fun.

REAL ramrod stock is much less expensive than a trip to the ER.
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Post by: Swamp on December 07, 2010, 06:10:25 AM
I agree with Kermit. You can buy hickory ramrods from many places, and even with shipping, it will be cheaper than the ER! Be safe!
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Post by: shootrj2003 on December 07, 2010, 10:24:12 AM
After listening to these responses from some very knowledgable gentlemen ,I'd have to withdraw my reccomendation to others to look into these dowels as a ramrod.I would not want my advise to be the cause of any one elses injury,so I would take thier advice and not use these.Be Safe guys,Sorry!
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Post by: pathfinder on December 07, 2010, 12:13:02 PM
Don't stop thinkin' of idea's,thats how great inventions are made,take the loading block for example.............................. :Doh!
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Post by: shootrj2003 on December 08, 2010, 11:55:01 AM
Please elucidate?
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Post by: Swamp on December 08, 2010, 12:27:03 PM
I agree with Pathfinder! Never stop looking for ideas, as well as asking about ideas you come up with. We're all here to help, educate, and learn.

But, nothing to be sorry about Shootrj. Just glad you asked before you bought.
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Post by: mark davidson on December 09, 2010, 11:02:03 AM
I came up with a great solution. It is called ALUMINUM!! :-)  I don't know how "traditional" it is or how frowned upon but I do know that my aluminum ramrod in my 38" full stock Hawken is NOT going to break and go through my hand or leave me out in the woods unable to load my rifle.  I bought a TC Renegade a while back that had a solid BRASS ramrod in it. So just how UN-trad and INcorrect is a metal ramrod??? I figure that the rest of the gun except the stock is made of metal so why hadicap the whole rig with a weak wood rod? Edurcate me!!!  :-)
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Post by: Captchee on December 09, 2010, 11:19:25 AM
look around some more shootr
 what you want is a good strait grained hickory rod .
 i have seen them  at home depot believe  it or not .
 you have to pick through to find a good one.
as was said . stay away from the oak  and such .
 
 now what has not been said here is that even a hickory rod can break .  just  far less likely if the rod is maintained and used properly
 having a RR break and go through your hand is no fun .
 I been there and still have the scare to prove it .
 and yes it was a hickory rod .
 but  in fairness  I was young . didn’t know what I was doing . I wanting using the rod correctly .

 through the years i have mad RR from  rose wood and even ebony .
 but even  with those woods  you have to maintain the rod . when loading you have to lean not to grasp the rod to far above the barrel . using short strokes to  push the ball down .

again having a strait grain hickory rod isnt going to  stop that rod from braking  if a person  grabs the end and tries to jam the  ball home ..
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Post by: shootrj2003 on December 10, 2010, 11:10:06 AM
My experience with metal rods is 1. aluminum-to me it's just not right 'I have a ''unbreakable ''rod but that is for staying at home ,it's not PC,even when hunting I strive for the experience of traditional ,if my ancestors were saddled with the problems of wood and suceeded than I can use wood with its problems ,in the event of woods failure than I am forced to solve a problem that an ancestor had to solve[or go home whipped , whining..or...captured uhh?] I have made my own in a pinch while out hunting  when  a rod cracked while loading up ,hemlock worked really well and I had it finished by the time I needed to reload[I got a doe] 4 hours later .
.2 Brass works well and is pc but adds weight and tends come loose due to momentum  so I stick to wood .Wood will break sometimes when you try not to use a short starter,did that twice.
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Post by: mark davidson on December 10, 2010, 01:30:34 PM
shootrj, Questions meant in all due respect....Where do you draw the line on PC?  What spoils your period rush? Do you wear completely period correct clothing?  No gore tex, no coated pvc raingear, no plastic buttons on your clothing, no modern zippers,...how about shoes?  Do you walk or ride a horse to your spot?  If a non-wood ramrod ruins it for you then there has to be a bushel of other stuff equally guilty.  I respect completely what you seem to be trying to do and I hope you respect where I am at. A metal ramrod hanging under my flinter or caplock does not bother me one bit, actually no worse than loading it at home with a steel range rod which most embrace as just fine. In my limited time afield or in the heat of the moment, I need a rod I can depend on and brass or aluminum works fine for me.
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Post by: shootrj2003 on December 10, 2010, 07:09:57 PM
I'm not suggesting or telling you to do it ,and if you and hunted together I would not even comment on it ,it's just something I do and I do hunt in camos or other modern clothes and sometimes more traditional garb so I guess I don't don't really draw a line on pc unless I went to a PC .event.I guess I really like wood ramrods and they just seem right to me.I did try a brass one as I thought the idea cool because I REALLY like brass too I was surprised at the weight dif that it made and it wasn't secure because of the weight.
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Post by: mark davidson on December 13, 2010, 09:05:55 AM
Shootrj, Thanks for the polite response. I promise I meant no foul in my question. I am only about three years into this more "traditional" black powder thing. When I first had a custom gun built, without knowing any better I suppose, I automatically had a solid aluminum ramrod built for it. It never occurred to me to actually use that flimsy wood one. My rifle had a rock on the hammer and that was all I really needed to get my period rush!!! :-)  I thought I might go out west for elk with my new toy and the idea of horsebacking around the mountains and depending on that little wood stick gave me chills. I too had an old TC rifle with a brass rod and I liked it but I figured solid aluminum would be lighter. Sometimes in whitetail hunting I take the wood rod but I have pretty much transitioned to the aluminum one. The finish matches the rifle metal pretty well and looks pretty natural on it.
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Post by: Firewalker on December 13, 2010, 09:47:19 AM
Some of us old guys have trouble holding the rifle up offhand without a ramrod, or even carrying it around all day. I can't imagine adding the weight of a brass ramrod to it.
If I was "way out in the toolies" I'd probably be carrying one of those unbreakable plastic ones just because of weight and dependability and just pretend it was wood. My imaginary space extends quite a ways around me when it has to.
At an event its wood for sure.
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Post by: Firewalker on December 13, 2010, 09:51:20 AM
One other thing...if you mistakenly shoot a ramrod at a tree it usually breaks. But...one of those plastic ones.....and I saw this happen.....will bend like a U and fly right back at you. So there! :rotf
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Post by: shootrj2003 on December 14, 2010, 09:10:46 AM
Mark,
  No offense taken and if you you spend the money on a horseback hunt for elk I could see why you might want to cover your base's  after all it would be a h@$% of a reason not to get your elk right? Firewaker- :(  :shake Dodging that plastic ramrod sounds REALLY scary to me!
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Post by: PJC on December 14, 2010, 07:11:35 PM
Quote from: "mark davidson"
shootrj, Questions meant in all due respect....Where do you draw the line on PC?  What spoils your period rush? Do you wear completely period correct clothing?  No gore tex, no coated pvc raingear, no plastic buttons on your clothing, no modern zippers,...how about shoes?  Do you walk or ride a horse to your spot?  If a non-wood ramrod ruins it for you then there has to be a bushel of other stuff equally guilty.  I respect completely what you seem to be trying to do and I hope you respect where I am at. A metal ramrod hanging under my flinter or caplock does not bother me one bit, actually no worse than loading it at home with a steel range rod which most embrace as just fine. In my limited time afield or in the heat of the moment, I need a rod I can depend on and brass or aluminum works fine for me.

That would make a great thread. I do not think it could be handled very well on some other forums. but TMA is not other forums.

We all do this to add primative and historical pioneer flavor to our hunting. Do you add a little spice to the recipe or the whole bottle.

There are so many things that we can never replicate. Even the woods in the east. At one point, one in four trees was an american chestnut tree. Can you imagine the food that provided for the wildlife. If an acorn is 15% protien then a chestnut  must be right up there.

Most guys can't haul all their gear on horseback so I think a few compromises are acceptable when packing stuff in. And we all want to get as far off the road as we can to get away from, from, well from everything.

For me clothing is where I am making some compromises. Especially in cold weather. Hunter Orange is a problem, a required  evil for most during big game season.

Water is another problem. not much good drinking water laying around on top of the ground these days.

Our pioneer ancestors did endure some hardships and it can be useful to experience and truly understand what they went through or how they accomplished some of these hard tasks BUT as in B*U*T we are doing this as a hobby to have fun and enjoy and learn. We have to be safe and we want to enjoy our pasttime.

Everyone finds their own balance point in PC. I think for many it changes from day to day, event to event. Season to season. etc.
flexibility in our degree of correctness and more importantly our tolerance of others choices makes this fun and makes TMA the best forum for this sport on the internet.

Boy I got long winded...

Pat
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Post by: PJC on December 14, 2010, 07:19:57 PM
As far as wiping sticks, I don't use mine for cleaning. I have some synthetic ones I purchased at Dixons that I use for that. Also I don't try to seat a ball with a big push, causing the stick to bow. Short 8 inch strokes, close to the muzzle and well supported. Sure it takes me a few minutes to load a ball but I ain't got not injuns trying to scalp me. I just take my time.
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Post by: shootrj2003 on December 14, 2010, 09:41:51 PM
Yeah I guess we all know there is only so far we can go with PC or we'd all be living in the woods!
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Post by: greyhunter on December 14, 2010, 10:33:14 PM
Well said Pat. I wish I could do more period attire, but Pa. requires orange,shudder, on yer noggin and body,small game and big game seasons, really screws up the visual effect of my capote and fox hat! No one here says ya hafta be pc to shoot yer deer, as long yer honest in yer hunt and yer choice of firearm. My hat is off to anyone who takes their deer with a trad rifle/musket/smoothie. It is truly a trophy to take pride in! I refuse to wear a breechclout in December, er for that matter any other time, it wouldn't be a pretty sight!
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Post by: pathfinder on December 15, 2010, 04:02:20 AM
Greyhunter,that's why our shirts are sooooo long! :rotf
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Post by: Riley/MN on December 15, 2010, 09:03:18 AM
Quote from: "greyhunter"
I refuse to wear a breechclout in December, er for that matter any other time, it wouldn't be a pretty sight!

Okay, well, your Christmas present is going to be a little late then...
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Post by: mark davidson on December 16, 2010, 01:32:57 PM
I can tell that I am getting gradually more and more into the period rush and maybe the P/C thing too.  I got me a capote from a nice gent on here last year and put some deer antler buttons on it and I do like the way it makes me feel to hunt in it. I also recently gave up my big ole mountain man belt I made with all my stuff on it in favor of a more practical possibles bag. All my powder measures and short starter are now hand made by me from deer antler instead of the store bought ones I used the first year or so. It is a journey and I do seem to be creeping BACK in time! :-) Gore tex and good boots will be the last things to go!!! :-)  :-)
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Post by: AxelP on December 16, 2010, 02:39:11 PM
I clean with a brass rod and use my wood rod while in the woods. I sometimes field clean with the wooden rod on most of my guns.  

I broke my wooden rod for one of my guns and as a quick replaecment I am using a brass rod... its a short barreled flinter (31" barrel) and the brass rod weight actually helps-- so I may keep it instead of getting a new wood rod....

K
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Post by: pathfinder on December 17, 2010, 12:28:42 AM
We moved this over to HUNTING