Post by: Feltwad on September 19, 2011, 07:40:47 AM
Feltwad
A Flint Lock will not secure a chicken house door
Post by: mario on September 19, 2011, 04:24:42 PM
Mario
Post by: BEAVERMAN on September 19, 2011, 05:57:20 PM
Quote from: "mario"
I guess not. Mostly because I have no idea what you're talking about.
Mario
Same here!, I'll bite,what the he77 is a tube lock?
Post by: biliff on September 19, 2011, 06:41:19 PM
http://www.collegehillarsenal.com/shop/product.php?printable=Y&productid=601
Post by: mario on September 19, 2011, 08:49:08 PM
Lorenz guns may well have gained a bad reputation from their association with older .71 caliber Austrian “Consol” or tube-lock muskets, which were conversions from flintlock. These guns, some of which were rifled, others not, were converted by a method devised by Giuseppe Consol of Milan. The Consol/Augustin system replaced the flintlock pan and frizzen with a two-piece priming chamber and installed a new hammer.
After muzzle loading the main charge in the usual manner, the Consol/Augustin was primed by bringing the hammer to half cock, lifting the top section of the priming chamber, which replaced the frizzen, inserting a small priming tube filled with percussion powder into a groove in the bottom section, which replaced the pan, then closing the chamber. The gun could then be brought to full cock and fired. The hammer hit a firing pin device in the chamber which, in turn, exploded the percussion tube and ignited the main charge. A number of these guns were converted to the standard percussion system before or after importation, but others, especially in the earliest days of the war, were placed directly in the hands of troops with their peculiar priming system intact.
While Austrian guns were imported during the ACW, I don't think this was one of the.
Mario
Post by: R.M. on September 19, 2011, 09:52:10 PM
Quote from: "mario"
While Austrian guns were imported during the ACW, I don't think this was one of the.I have an 1860 Austrian Lorenz that has "Ohio" stamped in the top of the wrist, and supposedly it was used in the ACW. It is much like any other percussion musket that was used then, other than it being .54 caliber.
Mario
Post by: Uncle Russ on September 19, 2011, 10:45:27 PM
Quote from: "biliff"
Out of pure curiosity I spent some time googling. This is the best picture w/description I could find. Sounds kind of cumberson and to answer the original question, it appears to be strictly a European thing (but apparently invented by an American. Go figure.)
http://www.collegehillarsenal.com/shop/product.php?printable=Y&productid=601
Thanks, Bill
I thought this part was rather ingenious;
"The system used an encapsulated copper primer with two hollow wire leads that extended from either side of the central casing. These leads formed a flash channel that communicated the ignition charge directly to the powder charge. One lead was inserted into the flash channel of the pan and the other stuck out of the opposite side of the pan. Closing the pan cover crimped off the lead on the non-ignition side, making sure that all of the priming force entered the main flash channel to ignite the primer charge. Once the pan was closed, a firing pin in the top of the pan rested upon the priming “pill” and the fall of the hammer forced the firing pin into the “pill”, igniting it".
A very early version of an in-line, as we know them today.
It seems Joe Bilby came up with some numbers for the CW and the Lorenz..."Yankee and Rebel buyers eagerly snapped up Lorenz-style rifle-muskets; the Union recorded purchases of 226, 924 and the Confederacy bought as many as 100,000.....making it the second most popular behind the Enfield"
With that many in circulation at the time, it would appear they would be more popular today.
One reason may well be, as Mario said, in that link we find...."Major General John C. Fremont purchased 25,000 tube-lock muskets in his desperate search for weapons in 1861 and at least 3,000 Delvigne chambered Austrian “Garibaldi” rifles were issued to Minnesota troops. The men of the 26th Illinois embarked on their military careers in September, 1861 armed with “hickory clubs,” and were then issued “old English Tower” muskets, which they later exchanged for “old Austrian fuse primer [guns] altered and rifled. By the end of the year an inspector classified the tubelock Consol/Augustin weapons as “nearly all…unfit for use.”.
Thanks to Bill and Mario for their information... :shock:
Sooo much to learn, sooo little time!
Uncle Russ...
Post by: Feltwad on September 20, 2011, 02:58:10 AM
The tubelock was prior to the percussion cap and dates from 1810 ,the lock parts were has follows ,the hammer instead of a nose was fitted with shield and what is known has a spade {see image} ,some of the large bore fowling guns hammers were fitted with a shield on the side ,this was to prevent the tube from blowing out when ignited . The barrel instead of a pan had what is known has a anvil on this was placed the tube which was a hollow piece of copper sealed at one end ,filled with a fultimate compound and inserted into a touch hole.When the hammer struck the tube it ignited the fultimate which fired into the touch hole and ignited the main charge, ignition is just has quick has the percussion cap
Feltwad
A Flint Lock will not secure a chicken house door
Post by: Swamp on September 20, 2011, 05:33:37 AM
Boy, in that last photo, that gun sure looks like it has a LARGE bore! :shake
Post by: Feltwad on September 20, 2011, 08:14:59 AM
Quote from: "Swamp"
Wow, very cool indeed! I never knew such a thing existed!Swamp.
Boy, in that last photo, that gun sure looks like it has a LARGE bore! :shake
Both are 6 bore,the Cox pigeon gun has a special forend with a pistol grip
Feltwad
A Flint Lock will not sercure a chicken house door
Post by: Loyalist Dave on September 20, 2011, 08:57:40 AM
Quote
A very early version of an in-line, as we know them today.
No, an early version of what evolved into the Caplock. The ingnition still enters at 90º to the chamber as does a flintlock and the later caplock.
LD
Post by: Gordon H.Kemp on September 22, 2011, 05:51:28 PM
:applaud
Post by: Feltwad on December 04, 2011, 01:22:44 PM
Feltwad
A Flint Lock will not secure a chicken house door
Post by: Feltwad on December 21, 2011, 02:09:53 PM
Lot 521 which was a 4 bore live pigeon gun a s/b by Lancaster sold for £7000 sterling
Lot 523 which was a 4 bore s/b fowling piece alos by Lancaster cased with accessiors sold for £22000 sterling{34.461.15 USD}.
Feltwad
A Flint Lock will not secure a chicken house door
Post by: Riley/MN on December 21, 2011, 02:56:11 PM
Post by: Feltwad on December 22, 2011, 09:20:22 AM
Quote from: "Riley/MN"
That is a good chunk o' change right there!I have heard that both lots were bought by the same gentleman so he must have thought they were a good buy .
Feltwad
A Flint Lock will not secure a chicken house door