Traditional Muzzleloading Association

Shooting Traditional Firearms and Weapons => General Interest => Topic started by: Forager on February 14, 2013, 04:39:40 PM

Title: .50 smooth?
Post by: Forager on February 14, 2013, 04:39:40 PM
Any thoughts on the practicality, use (game, range, capability, recoil), and otherwise of a .50 smoothbore in general?

How about a rather lightweight version (sub 6#)?
Title: Re: .50 smooth?
Post by: sse on February 14, 2013, 04:51:30 PM
There are guys out there who shoot 'smooth rifles', smaller bores, and I guess they can dial them in to be pretty accurate.  I was on a woods walk once and one of the shooters was using one and he was hitting his mark pretty well.  They are historically correct and I think the use in hunting would be about the same as any other muzzleloader.  I'd have to wonder about the effective range as far as accuracy, as compared to a 'rifle'...maybe somebody who shoots one will chime in.
Title: Re: .50 smooth?
Post by: rollingb on February 14, 2013, 06:03:38 PM
Quote from: "Forager"
Any thoughts on the practicality, use (game, range, capability, recoil), and otherwise of a .50 smoothbore in general?

How about a rather lightweight version (sub 6#)?

Sean,...... I have no experience with a .50 smooth bore (smallest smoothie I have is a .58 ca. /24ga.),... but the NWTG's in 28, 24, and 20 gauges were very popular trade items during the fur trade era.

28 gauge is .54 calibur.,.... so a .50 calibur is 32 ga. (32 balls to-the-pound)  :)
Title: Re: .50 smooth?
Post by: pathfinder on February 14, 2013, 10:10:49 PM
David Robinson here on our site has one I built,and when I had it,she shot r/b well and shot so-so. I never spent a lot of time working up a load,but a cyliner bore,i wouldn't expect a whole lot. As a rifle,she was a shooter!
Title: Re: .50 smooth?
Post by: gunmaker on February 14, 2013, 10:30:29 PM
Well I've build a number of 32 bore, .50 cal. guns cap & flint.  At 15-20 paces they will throw a shot pattern of # 7 or 8's to point of aim. I have a target with 138 strikes @ 20 yd.  in a 30" circle  #7 lead.  30" bbl.  50gr 3f & equal shot.  Great for small critters.  A .490 PRB with a tight patch will kill a deer sized animal @ 25 yd. With a LOP of 13-14" and drop 2-3/4" -to 3.00"@ heel recoil is very mild.  Weigh ?  about 4 lb.  with a sling.  I carry one one our local treking gigs.   Like the 22 long rifle they are much underestimated....Tom
Title: Re: .50 smooth?
Post by: Uncle Russ on February 15, 2013, 12:00:18 AM
We have a member by the name of "Three-Hawks", and if I am not mistaken he still owns and shoots his .50 smoothie.
Had a long discussion with him one time in Monroe, which was the only time I had ever met him, and it seemed to me he was totally convinced that the 32 bore smoothie was all a man ever needed for about anything, but especially for living off the land.

Maybe he will see this and stop by, he has a way with words and he can tell the stories much better than I can repeat them. Very interesting gun, this 32 bore smoothie!

Uncle Russ..
Title: Re: .50 smooth?
Post by: gunmaker on February 15, 2013, 12:43:06 AM
Here's one. .50 cal. Rayl bbl.  Siler little lock walnut stock....Tom
Title: Re: .50 smooth?
Post by: Uncle Russ on February 15, 2013, 01:44:52 AM
Is this the one that only weighs about 5#???
Nice looking little riflegun!  :lt th

I like your work, Tom

Uncle Russ...
Title: Re: .50 smooth?
Post by: Forager on February 15, 2013, 06:30:33 AM
Quote from: "gunmaker"
Well I've build a number of 32 bore, .50 cal. guns cap & flint.  At 15-20 paces they will throw a shot pattern of # 7 or 8's to point of aim. I have a target with 138 strikes @ 20 yd.  in a 30" circle  #7 lead.  30" bbl.  50gr 3f & equal shot.  Great for small critters.  A .490 PRB with a tight patch will kill a deer sized animal @ 25 yd. With a LOP of 13-14" and drop 2-3/4" -to 3.00"@ heel recoil is very mild.  Weigh ?  about 4 lb.  with a sling.  I carry one one our local treking gigs.   Like the 22 long rifle they are much underestimated....Tom

That's about what I'm talking about!

So, is about 25 yards all that can be expected with a prb?  What's it like at 50 and 75?

The shot patterns are about what I was anticipating, and that's good to know (pot filler).
Title: Re: .50 smooth?
Post by: gunmaker on February 15, 2013, 11:36:29 AM
I just haven't fired it at more than 25 yd with PRB.  I really don't have a plan to shoot deer with it, mostly doves, pidgeons  grouse & rabbits.  They make great rondy guns for trail walks---Usually almost everyone else has a 20, or 12 bore.  They quit smirking when it rings the gongs just like a REAL gun...Tom
Title: Re: .50 smooth?
Post by: LeeRoy on February 15, 2013, 04:06:52 PM
Tom
Nice looking Smoothy !

LeeRoy
Title: Re: .50 smooth?
Post by: Captchee on February 16, 2013, 11:44:40 AM
I   have French  32 bore in the planning stages .  past that I have never  built a smooth 50 .
 But I can tell you about smooth 54 cal  which IMO would be near the same .
Now those I have built a couple of .
 Here is my smooth  54 . Which is set to a Hudson valley stock . The barrel is 52 inchs long .
With shot , she holds a  tighter group then full choke . With Rb she shoots better IMO then any of my 62 cal smooth guns ever did . as to range ? i have no more issue with hiting targets at distance then i did with the larger bores . rested she will still  place the balls on a 8 inch target every time

(http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y242/captchee/Rifles/Dsc00924.jpg)

(http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y242/captchee/Rifles/DSC00926-1.jpg)

(http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y242/captchee/Rifles/DSC00935.jpg)

(http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y242/captchee/Rifles/DSC00922.jpg)

 here is the original link to  when i first finished it and took it out to shoot

http://www.traditionalmuzzleloadingassociation.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10&t=13956&hilit=hudson+valley
Title: Re: .50 smooth?
Post by: gunmaker on February 17, 2013, 11:39:48 AM
4 lb. loaded with sling Russ.  That's a great one Cap,  to bad you didn't put a long barrel on it....Tom
Title: Re: .50 smooth?
Post by: Forager on February 17, 2013, 12:44:03 PM
Can we get some other pictures of that little four-pounder?

And, yeah, captchee's work is VERY nice.  I've had the privilege to handle a few of his pieces, and highly functional (probably habit-forming) art is about the best description I can muster to cover the breadth.
Title: Re: .50 smooth?
Post by: gunmaker on February 17, 2013, 01:07:56 PM
Forager, there are 3 pic's at gunbuilding.  Under bunny snuffer....Tom
Title: Re: .50 smooth?
Post by: Captchee on February 19, 2013, 10:54:19 AM
Quote
That's a great one Cap, to bad you didn't put a long barrel on it....Tom

ya 52 was as short as i had read about for that type of gun .  had a heck of a time finding that leanght lol .

plus i get enough razing at smooth bore events  with that long of a barrel anyway . i could imagine what i would get it i showed up with a 67  or 72 inch barrel LMAO
Title: Re: .50 smooth?
Post by: gunmaker on February 19, 2013, 11:09:47 AM
I saw a pic of a southern smoothbore, with an Ed Rayl bbl.  72" long.  I'm 5'10" would have to carry a "loading step" everywhere....Tom
Title: Re: .50 smooth?
Post by: Captchee on February 19, 2013, 11:12:35 AM
ya ed could have made me a barrel but it would have been a 2 year wait .  i didnt want to wait that long . to  6 months for the one i got
Title: Re: .50 smooth?
Post by: gunmaker on February 19, 2013, 07:10:51 PM
if you don't mind, who made it?  i like Rayl bbl. but 1-2 yr IS a long time....Tom
Title: Re: .50 smooth?
Post by: Captchee on February 19, 2013, 11:36:56 PM
i called Ray Franks and he had a person he used for his guns . so i just ordered it through Ray
Title: Re: .50 smooth?
Post by: pathfinder on February 20, 2013, 09:53:41 AM
When I get home,I'll get ya Larry Hornigan's number. He makes custom smooth barrel's along with Muzleloading air rifles,per Dennis Priddy. GREAT guy to deal with. I'll also see him at K-zoo. I'm ordering a 58" 28ga top flat round barrel. Cool,Cool,Cool.
Title: Re: .50 smooth?
Post by: Captchee on February 20, 2013, 10:14:49 AM
the  historic air rifle thing IMO would be a kick in the pants . would love to build one of those one day
Title: Re: .50 smooth?
Post by: Riley/MN on February 20, 2013, 10:22:50 AM
Quote from: "Captchee"
the  historic air rifle thing IMO would be a kick in the pants . would love to build one of those one day

 :hairy
Title: Re: .50 smooth?
Post by: gunmaker on February 20, 2013, 11:43:19 AM
58" pathfinder??? you better get a pair of HIGH HEALS, something cute--he-he !!....Tom
Title: Re: .50 smooth?
Post by: rickevans on February 20, 2013, 12:51:06 PM
Don't encourage him... :shock:
Title: Re: .50 smooth?
Post by: rollingb on February 20, 2013, 01:24:33 PM
Quote from: "rickevans"
Don't encourage him... :rotf  :rotf
Title: Re: .50 smooth?
Post by: Uncle Russ on February 20, 2013, 02:27:47 PM
Quote from: "rollingb"
Quote from: "rickevans"
Don't encourage him... :rotf  :Doh! I gotta see this!
Double-Dog dare ya Path....

 :rotf  :applaud
Title: Re: .50 smooth?
Post by: Kermit on February 25, 2013, 05:42:56 PM
Brian Turner built me a cherry stocked .50 smoothrifle a few years back. I'd had this thing that I wanted a .50 cal smoothrifle with a 50" barrel by the time I was 50. Didn't make the age goal. I went for 46" when I was 56. Longhammock OTR barrel.

Mine likes a .480 ball, tightly patched. I can put 3 balls into a 3" circle from a rest at 50 yards. Don't ask about offhand.  :oops:  Shot load is 50 grains of FFg Goex, 2 thin cards, equal volume #6-7.5-8. shot and another card on the shot. Good for bunnies and grouse out to 20 yards or so. I prefer it with shot for small game. Not getting a lot of use these days, but I love the gun.
Title: Re: .50 smooth?
Post by: gunmaker on February 25, 2013, 06:28:12 PM
Pic's Kermit--if you please.....Tom
Title: Re: .50 smooth?
Post by: pathfinder on February 26, 2013, 10:49:04 AM
Quote from: "RussB"
Quote from: "rollingb"
Quote from: "rickevans"
Don't encourage him... :rotf  :Doh! I gotta see this!
Double-Dog dare ya Path....

 :rotf  :applaud
See me a Lapeer! I'll have 'em glittered by K-Zoo! They'll match my breach clout!
Title: Re: .50 smooth?
Post by: sse on February 26, 2013, 10:57:05 AM
Quote
Don't ask about offhand.
"Say there, what about offhand...?"  LOL
Title: Re: .50 smooth?
Post by: mario on February 26, 2013, 02:10:11 PM
I had a 28bore/.55" a few years ago. I think it weighed in at 7.5lbs.

Did just fine with ball (wadded) out to 50yds.

The biggest issue with them is VOLUME of shot. The bigger bores are more forgiving just because they just carry more shot. Still did pretty well for squirrel.

As for wanting a light gun, my Type G/Carolina Trade Gun has a 48"/20ga barrel and weighs 6lbs 2oz.

Makes my 8lb fusil de chasse feel like an artillery piece!

Mario