leaky cups

[wwpete52]

I have 3 tin cups that are leaking.  What is the best way to fix them (other than buying new cups)?

[Riley/MN]

Drink faster???

[melsdad]

I imagine you could solder them.

[Three Hawks]

Most of the cheap tin cups sold now are not waterproof in the first place.  If you look carefully at the joint where the bottom of the handle attaches to the bowl of the cup you'll see it is loose in the rolled joint,   as well as being incorporated into the bottom-side joint.  There is no way I can think of that will make that joint water tight as there is some sort of rubber like sealant in there. Heating it makes an awful mess.

I suggest getting higher quality cups made by a competent tinsmith and having them tinned inside and out. It ain't gonna be too cheap.  Or go the way I finally did and get a stoneware mug.  That ain't cheap either.

Try Jas. Townsend and Sons,  

G.Gedney Godwin,

Track of the Wolf, and

Turkey Foot Trading CLICK   I'd try TTF TRADING First, but that's just me and I like 'em.

Three Hawks

[Mike Ameling]

You only really have two choices for a fix.  One is to solder or re-solder the bottom joint/seam.  Or you could use some modern epoxy to glue the seam/joint.  

The cheapo tin cups so many mass vendors sell at events just don't last very long before they leak or rust out.  But if you make the investment in a quality hot-dipped tin cup from a good tinsmith using proper historical methods and styling, it will last you far longer than buying 4 or 5 of the cheapo's.  In the end you will end up paying less for better quality.

Mikey

[Bigsmoke]

Or, you could do what I have done.
You got the cup, drink really strong, nasty coffee out of it, and never rinse it out.  It will seal itself.  Plus, it make for an interesting lab experiment, sort of like a tin Petri dish.

[wwpete52]

The 3 cups that are leaking are not the cheapo kind of cups.  They are the heavy hand made tin cups.

[Three Hawks]

The 3 cups that are leaking are not the cheapo kind of cups.  They are the heavy hand made tin cups.

In that case sealing the leaky place(s) should be a cinch.  Get some low temp lead free solder from the hardware store and simply solder from the inside  of the cup with it using a propane torch.   I did my replica Hudson's Bay 1 qt copper kettle that way and haven't had drip since.   It took all of a minute or so.

Most of the low temp lead free solders are around 94% tin with some other metal in it to make it flow more easily.  None are harmful to the greater primates including most of the humanoids.

Three Hawks

[wwpete52]

That sounds like a winner! Thanks Three Hawks!

[Mike Ameling]

There are also differences in the style of construction of tin cups that nobody has talked about either.

What does that bottom seam look like?  When most people talk about a "tin cup", they are generally talking about those with a machine rolled/crimped bottom seam.  The bottom kind of looks like that on a modern bean or coffee can - recessed a bit with that rolled/crimped rim sticking slightly down.  Well, many of those rely upon that machine rolled/crimped seam to seal themselves up.  They may or may not have been soldered inside.  But many just seal the bottom with that hand-cranked mechanical seal as they roll and crimp that seam.  That mechanical seal is faster and easer to make, but can lead to failures.  But it also starts to date that tin cup to around 1840 and later - after those hand-cranked tinsmith machines started to become available for use.

The older style of bottom seam was a flat disk with the outside edge turned up 90 degrees, and then the sides of the cup set straight down into it.  Then the seam was soldered to bond it and seal it.  
Or they used a "tabbed" bottom.  The bottom edge of the sides of the cup were cut into tabs, with every other one bent in.  Then a round disk was set in flush, then the other tabs bent down over that bottom locking that disk in place.  And then the whole thing soldered to seal.  

But most "tin cups" you see, even by some of the better tinsmiths, have that hand-cranked machine rolled and crimped seam.  They do it for the savings in time and energy when manufacturing a cup.  Those mid 1800's and later hand-cranked tinsmithing machines were made to speed up production and cut manufacturing costs.

Just something else to ponder.

Mikey - that grumpy ol' German blacksmith out in the Hinterlands

[Three Hawks]

Written by Mikey, the Grumpy ol' Gunsmith.

"But most "tin cups" you see, even by some of the better tinsmiths, have that hand-cranked machine rolled and crimped seam. They do it for the savings in time and energy when manufacturing a cup. Those mid 1800's and later hand-cranked tinsmithing machines were made to speed up production and cut manufacturing costs."

Mikey, you say "even by some of the better tinsmiths" as if it were a bad thing.  The roll crimped cups and kettles were done that way, as you say, to keep time and costs down.  It also resulted in producing a better product faster,  making it cheaper to buy and affording the maker a better profit.  My HBC kettle is "tabbed" with a very complex rim and bail ears.  The seam of the body is also "tabbed" and that kettle, while nearly a work of art,  would take an experienced craftsman several hours to do,  to say nothing of the time spent making the lid with it's wired rim and and ring.  I also have a 2 qt.  tinned sheet steel boiler made by roll crimping the body seam,  rolling the bottom to the body and soldering. The bail ears are simply rivetted to the body and a bail made of iron wire.   I would venture to say that a competent tinker could make a dozen of these in the time it takes  to make one of the HBC kettles and is at least as good quality.  

One thing I've learned to do is keep both away from the fire unless there's water in 'em.  They unsolder themselves in a heartbeat if they're dry.  

The new food can style tin cups I have have a synthetic sticky sealant in them, and with the handle attatchment incorporated into the bottom seam and the rim, begin leaking almost as soon as the cup has liquid put in it.  Soldering those seams is not possible.

I'd almost bet money that Wally's cups are made by turning up a flange on the bottom of the cup, then soldering, with the handle rivetted to the bowl of the cup.  That style tends to be more attratictive (to me at least) and durable as well as lending itself to speedy, efficacious repairs should the need arise.

Three Hawks

[Mike Ameling]

No, tinware made using those hand-cranked machines is not a bad thing.  They really do speed up production and help make things more afforable.  I was just pointing out that particular method of construction of tinware points to a later time period - 1840's and later.  That little ... detail ... is more important to some people than others.  It all depends upon the personal level people choice for their gear in this Living History hobby.  

Most people either don't know or do not see the differences in the method of construction of tinware - and most don't seem to care.  So it's not a "bad thing" or a "good thing".  It just is.

Mikey