Continental Percussion Rifle

[Ohio Joe]

The first muzzle loading firearm seems to have the appearance of a Schutzen Rifle. I'm not so sure what the second muzzle loader might be unless it's a big smooth bore elephant gun? Note the sling swivels. This rather gives me the idea of someone who may have traveled to Africa on big game safaris.

Did I miss it, or was bore sizes given?

[Uncle Russ]

Did I miss it, or was bore sizes given?

Joe, I think he said the bottom one was a 16 gauge.

You're right, I have also read about smooth bores being used for big game in Africa, especially the larger calibers,such as 8, 6, and 4 bore.
If I remember correctly, early thinking was that the smooth bores would supposedly not loose the energy required to "spin" the patched ball in the rifling.....to some that makes sense, to others, myself included, not so much, as I have no way of knowing how that loss of energy was measured, other than penetration.
IOW; The gyroscopic "spin", or stabilization of the round ball was felt to be unnecessary in the close ranges that some big game was hunted.

(To me, and a few others I have associated with, the presence of a rear sight was about the only thing that differentiated between a smooth bore rifle and a regular smooth bore...of course, there could well be much more to this.)

If I'm not mistaken some of this is in the following link.
Giant Bores | Classic African Cartridges 4 And 6

If Bigsmoke sees this he will likely chime in.

Uncle Russ...

[Feltwad]

I believe this gun to be a Swiss Military / Target rifle not a African big game rifle ,to me this gun may have began has a rifle and later bored smoothbore the muzzle is crowned
Feltwad

[Ohio Joe]

Any idea what that brass extension might be in front of the trigger guard?

[Bigsmoke]

Did I miss it, or was bore sizes given?

Joe, I think he said the bottom one was a 16 gauge.



If I'm not mistaken some of this is in the following link.
Giant Bores | Classic African Cartridges 4 And 6

If Bigsmoke sees this he will likely chime in.

Uncle Russ...

Russ, that was a very interesting article.  Interesting, but I am sure there are a few points that could be argued with.  If I can remember a few things that I read about years ago, many of the ivory hunters were a bit reluctant to give up their muzzleloading 8 and 4 bore rifles.  I believe it was Finnaughty who mentioned that a 10 bore cartridge rifle beat him up much worse than his 4 bore muzzleloader ever did.  There were a few things attributed to Baker that did not sound like what he supposedly said as well.  I will do a little research and maybe post things under a different thread.  Not wanting to dilute this one.  It is too interesting.
John

[RobD]

If it's a SMOOTHBORE it ain't a rifle! ...

technically by name, it's a "smooth rifle" - that is, a smoothbore that has the design geometry of a rifle, and the rear sight of a rifle, but with no barrel rifling.

here's one i just sold ...



rear sight ...

[Mike Brooks]

I believe this gun to be a Swiss Military / Target rifle not a African big game rifle ,to me this gun may have began has a rifle and later bored smoothbore the muzzle is crowned
Feltwad

My assessment as well, Swiss military. It was most likely rifled when it was manufactured. The gizmo on the bottom probably has something to do with shooting from a rest. I imagine this gun is fairly heavy.

[Feltwad]

After further research the gun I believe is a Swiss military/Target rifle bored smoothbore and the makers name is Sckenk who were gunmakers in Bern Switzerland, the coat of arms for Bern is the bear within the shield  which is on the flats next to the breech
Feltwad