"Traditional Archery"

[faithtreker]

It's funny how we use the term traditional archery these days. I have a Black widow takedown longbow
with ratter skins on. Price $1200.00. I shoot carbon arrows that are about $110 dozen. I just stuck $40.00 worth of brass inserts in them to weight the front end. Add a broadhead that averages about ten dollars each. What ever happened to the "stick and string"? [for the pleasure I get, it's worth every penny!]

[Fletcher]

By some accounts if it does not have wheels it is traditional.

Others would say the bow should not have any metal and the arrow should be wood with feathers.

I say that I will defend to the death your right to shoot whatever you want.

As for me, I have been there with all the most up to date modern stuff and now in my old age I
prefer my bow to be all wood and my arrows to be all wood including self nocked.  I also prefer Muzzleloaders
to modern firearms.

Just remember Quigley when he blew the bad guy away with the Colt .45.  He said in response....
"I told you I preferred not to use pistols - I never said that I did not know how to use one!"

[bluelake]

Although I understand some peoples' strong feelings on labels, I find many go overboard.  I used to shoot a FITA style bow (like those shot in the Olympics) many, many years ago; my bow looked like something that should be orbiting the earth.  When I took up Korean traditional archery twenty years ago, I never looked back.  That was my choice, but I'm happy for those who still shoot FITA (many are good friends of mine).  

I've seen snobbishness on all sides.  In order to join some activities or events, you must have certain equipment (sometimes it's practical, but other times it's just bias).  I have seen it in the States and here in Korea.  To give an example, the WTAF (World Traditional Archery Festival, held annually here in Korea) does not allow non-Koreans to use Korean bows; you are required to use a "traditional" bow from your own country.  I stopped going to the WTAF after two years, even though I was in the original organizing committee, as I only shoot Korean trad bows.  Some countries don't even have their own traditional archery (i.e. Australia).  Also here in Korea, in order to shoot a bow in a competition, it must be from a company approved by the Korea Traditional Archery Association (and it's all political).

Personally, like Fletcher, I think people should shoot what they want to shoot.

[prairie dog]

"Traditional" can have a broad definition.

I started in archery as a child with a bow I made myself with no instructions or guidance.  You see, my parents would not buy a bow for me so I made my own tackle on the sly without their knowing.  

I used osage orange  or bois d' arc for the bow with my Dad's trot line for string.  I made arrows from willow shoots, bird feathers, and points cut from tin cans.  I actually killed a few rabbits and one mallard drake with that tackle before my folks realized I was doing it.  They gave in and let me buy a glass re-curve bow and wood arrows.

After college, I got full into the compound modern archery stuff and hunted with that until rotator cuff problems brought that to a halt.

Recently, I got back into archery because of rendezvous competition.  My present tackle is what I call "primitive".  My bow is an English style longbow, osage orange with a bamboo back. I use a linen string with a tied on silk thread nocking point.  Arrows are port oxford cedar with cut nocks and feather fletching.  The only item that is not primitive or natural material are my field points.  Using primitive stone or trade style points is just too hard on the targets we shoot.

I think of "primitive" archery as all natural materials.  "Traditional" archery can include modern glass laminate recurve bows, Fred Bear style broad heads, dacron strings, or anything without wheels and sighting devices. There doesn't seam to be a hard and fast definition of traditional.

[Cannonball]

I've been shooting a longbow for over 15 years along with wood arrows (I do use plastic nocks) and I love it. But when I had my super expensive Saluki hand made Turk Horsebow the only arrows that would fly with any consitency were carbons. It was an amazing bow but I got bored with it.

[pathfinder]

I've seen snobbishness on all sides.  
quote]

Snobbery?Snobbery? there's no snobbery! But if your not shooting a Trade gun,your not REALLY a shooter!

I recall ALL those years ago,I was @ 6,when Fred Bear would come to our scout's meetings and teach us archery. Now THAT was Traditional! Sure he advocated the use of "glass" bow's now and then,but if I remember right, Wood arrow's were THE ONLY shafts to use! But,that was 53 years ago. And I STILL am in awe of him!

If you want to really go traditional, pick up "Mystic Warrior's of the Plains",by Thomas Mails. Big coffee table style book. I use that book tomake my traditionl archery stuff,along with Ben Hunt's book's.

$1200.00 bow? $110.00 a dozen fer arra's Wheew!  I'm with Fletch,I'll fight like heck for you right to use whatever you want,but............LOL!!!

[Spotted Bull]

I love traditional archery...cuz I can't afford to shoot anything but the least expensive all-wood-no-training-wheel kinda bows.

But thats all I like anyway...

[pathfinder]

I love traditional archery...cuz I can't afford to shoot anything but the least expensive all-wood-no-training-wheel kinda bows.

But thats all I like anyway...

I make arrow's from dowels I get from Menard's,self nock,feathers from what I find on the ground,ect.... I was told you cant use feathers like that,you HAVE to have them right wing,left wing,ect.... they seem to work fine,i usually finish pretty good in informal shooting like we do at rendezvous,even with stone tip's!

[Uncle Russ]

This thread has warmed me old heart!

I like to "think" traditional, but I ain't, not really. And it kinda hurts to say that.

My dozen Traditional "arrers" came from our own Fletcher, many cold winters ago, and I better not hear of anybody ever shootin 'em! You gotta be kidding!
Not only are they too purdy, but they're are the only traditional arrers I own.

Some arrers were made fer shootin, some fer lookin.
But I have shot 'em, shot 'em a bunch in fact, even kilt me a big ol' ugly possum with one, and anything that will punch a hole through that thick barrier of ugliness has simply gotta be good.

Although my bow itself has been traditional for many years I've always shot Easton's,  actually Carbons in the last few years.
They shoot well, at least as good as my traditional, and if I loose or damage one, it ain't the end of the world.

I went through that stage where my bow looked like it was a direct import from outer space, what with pulleys, cables, sights, over-draws, and trigger releases,  it's no wonder I have a bad back.
But as others have said, there is something about that Longbow that pulls ya like a nail to a magnet, and the release from that attraction is very stubborn....indeed.

I've always looked at it as "Traditional is, as traditional is"....as long as the bow is truly traditional, you're half way there!

Uncle Russ...

[Fletcher]

Pathfinder, I got to meet Fred Bear at a Sportsman show in Missoula Montana, I think
it was 1969.  I got his autograph and a patch.  That really floated my boat.  I was so
disappointed when the museum was moved from Grayling MI.  I envy you living so close
to a 'legend'

I got to know Glen St. Charles and Susanne too at the Northwest Archery shop when I
lived near Seattle.  It was a shame to see that museum go as well when Glenn sold off
the property.  I think it all went to the Bear museum now in Florida.

As things change and fade away, it becomes harder to remember, let alone hold on to
the things we all cared for as 'traditional'.  The same is happening in Muzzleloading.

It is so good to have an organization such as TMA to keep the fires alive.

PS - y'all get a chance to read 'Bows on the Little Delta' some time - be sure to do that
(by Glen St. Charles)

[rickevans]

I met Fred once while in Grayling as a kid. Yes, he made an impression on me. I started shooting a red fiberglass bow in my basement when I was about 8 years old. I could never get used to a compound bow at all. I have a couple (well, a few...ok...ok...several) "traditional" bows and a couple primitives (self bows) and a bamboo backed osage.  I shoot carbons out of my fancy Assenheimer Master Hunter. The rest all use Cedar or similar.

[sse]

It is so good to have an organization such as TMA to keep the fires alive.

[size=200]Yes...[/size]

[sse]

I met Fred once while in Grayling as a kid. Yes, he made an impression on me. I started shooting a red fiberglass bow in my basement when I was about 8 years old. I could never get used to a compound bow at all. I have a couple (well, a few...ok...ok...several) "traditional" bows and a couple primitives (self bows) and a bamboo backed osage.  I shoot carbons out of my fancy Assenheimer Master Hunter. The rest all use Cedar or similar.

My uncle used to tell a story of when he was with a group of hunters up north, few of them played football for the Lions, that included Fred Bear.  I'm sure he was just indulging the celebs.  Anyway, he spoke of one morning when a truck was driving around dropping off each hunter at a given stand, but before the last guy was dropped off, Fred Bear had already shot his deer!  I never asked whether it was with a bow...

[Cannonball]

Pathfinder, I got to meet Fred Bear at a Sportsman show in Missoula Montana, I think
it was 1969.  I got his autograph and a patch.  That really floated my boat.  I was so
disappointed when the museum was moved from Grayling MI.  I envy you living so close
to a 'legend'

I got to know Glen St. Charles and Susanne too at the Northwest Archery shop when I
lived near Seattle.  It was a shame to see that museum go as well when Glenn sold off
the property.  I think it all went to the Bear museum now in Florida.

As things change and fade away, it becomes harder to remember, let alone hold on to
the things we all cared for as 'traditional'.  The same is happening in Muzzleloading.

It is so good to have an organization such as TMA to keep the fires alive.

PS - y'all get a chance to read 'Bows on the Little Delta' some time - be sure to do that
(by Glen St. Charles)

I got to meet Glen when the museum was still over in South Seattle. I loved that place and was truly sad to see it go.

ps why all the fuss over laminated bows vs primative flatbows? As far as I can find there is no documentation to indicate that any pre 1840's trapper carried a bow for either hunting or self defense so why raise a stink at rondy's? My Saxon longbow also known as an American longbow is considered traditional in most circles but not within this hobby? Just curious.

[prairie dog]

 ps why all the fuss over laminated bows vs primative flatbows? As far as I can find there is no documentation to indicate that any pre 1840's trapper carried a bow for either hunting or self defense so why raise a stink at rondy's? My Saxon longbow also known as an American longbow is considered traditional in most circles but not within this hobby? Just curious.

It depends on whose rendezvous.  I just wrote up the flier for next years Frozen Foot Rendezvous where I said:
 

Archery field or target points are allowed.  Broad heads and metal trade points are not because these cutting types of heads damage our targets.  Any style of primitive archery equipment that was in use prior to 1840 is acceptable.

My study of Native American archery turns up many types of laminated bows utilizing different materials from horn, antler, sinew, bamboo, among the Natives depending on where they were located and what materials were available to them.

The bow I shoot is more an English longbow.  The Plains Indians bows are just too short for my style of shooting where I anchor to my jawbone.  Those short bows were used from horse back and the Plains Indian did not draw to an anchor point like the Europeans did.  

I too can find no documentation for archery being used by white trappers or at a rendezvous.  Heck, even the Natives gave up bows and arrows as soon as they could get a gun.  

I fail to see the point of archery competition at modern rendezvous.  But one of my friends said "it takes the place of knife fighting and white women".

So I go along with the games that are played at modern rendezvous because I'm getting a little old to be knife fighting, ear chewing, and eye gouging.

Back to my rendezvous, we don't care if your bow is Native American, English longbow, Korean, Mongolian, or Japanese.  As long as it is made of natural materials you can shoot with us.