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Author Topic: A Niel Fields Flintlock  (Read 1906 times)

Offline RonC

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A Niel Fields Flintlock
« on: October 14, 2014, 07:22:48 PM »
I was very fortunate to acquire this flintlock that was built by Neil Fields of Green River rifle works fame. I have put information and photos up on another longrifle site, but I would like the comments from the knowledgeable people here.

It has an original Mortimer lock in it which is probably 1810 or later, with a 7/8 x 36" .50 barrel and he finished it February 1990. The lock has a rollered frizzen, very smooth internals. The rifle weighs in at just 6.5 lbs. Barrel has 8 lands and grooves.
One individual on another site said that it is a small Beck style. Not all agree. Another pointed out that the lock appears out of character for an otherwise, early Lancaster styled rifle. “I can't tell if the lock panels are otherwise accentuated, but would have expected to see beaver tails behind at the very least. The angle of the cheek piece and trigger guard also reflect Lancaster rather than Beck....subtle differences.”








HW Mortimer was an “Armourer to the Queen” and he and his son Harvey Walklate Mortimer were London gunsmiths' between 1753 and 1819 with premises at Fleet Street (see page 187 of British Gunmakers London By Brown).
Ron

Online Hank in WV

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Re: A Niel Fields Flintlock
« Reply #1 on: October 14, 2014, 09:47:19 PM »
It seems to have a bit more drop at the heel than your average Lancaster. More like a Bedford without the curved buttplate. That is one gorgeous piece of wood.
Hank in WV
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Offline twisted_1in66

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Re: A Niel Fields Flintlock
« Reply #2 on: October 15, 2014, 10:01:13 AM »
Drop at comb and heel are huge on this rifle - much more like you'd expect to see from a Lehigh or Bucks County rifle but both of those are heavily curved on the underside of the stock and this one is really straight like a Lancaster.  The Lehigh had a stepped wrist and the Bucks county was a continuous curve.  Both had a really large drop at heel but not so huge at the comb.  

The wood, the Rococo carving, and the finish is beautiful and the sliding wood patchbox is elegant. The curve on the buttstock is consistent with Rev War era rifles.  All of which point towards an early Lancaster time period. The rounded back on the lockplate however is early 1800's style which is inconsistent with the sliding wood patchbox and lack of decoration on the rifle.  Rifles of the Golden-Age period were much more heavily decorated than pre-war and Rev War rifles, with brass stars or decor at the pins on the forend and often brass decor (weeping hearts, hunting stars, etc.) on the wrist and cheek-rest along with brass pierced patchboxes.  Until you see the lock it looks like an early Lancaster rifle to me with an excessive amount of drop at heel and comb.   And then you see the lock which is definitely Golden Age era.

You could change the lock to an early Lancaster style to be more consistent with the rest of the look of the rifle, but if it's an original Mortimer lock, it would be a crime to do so.  To further complicate the style, if it was a rifle made in England by the Mortimers, it would be made out of walnut, not Maple.  They didn't have the hard maple in England suitable for making guns and walnut was the preferred wood.  The lock could easily have been imported from England though.

So your rifle is a bit of a conundrum... Nonetheless, it's a beautiful rifle and if you find you just can't handle the contradiction in styles, feel free to ship it to me.  Then it will be my problem! :shock:  8)

Twisted_1in66
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Twisted_1in66

Offline RonC

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Re: A Niel Fields Flintlock
« Reply #3 on: October 15, 2014, 10:16:13 AM »
Thank you for the valuable education about the rifle as well as the historical characteristics of Golden Era and Rev. era rifles.
I am relatively new at this, starting about 2 years ago with the purchase of 2, inexpensive, Armi San Marco and CVA percussion rifles at a rendezvous. I have only dug myself deeper into this interest and now have 2 of Shumway's books and additional flintlocks.

The rifle was built around the lock. To me, the lock represents a palpable history, a history I can touch, hold and feel. And, it sparks like crazy!

Thanks again,
Ron

Offline snake eyes

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Re: A Niel Fields Flintlock
« Reply #4 on: October 15, 2014, 10:41:31 AM »
Ron,
      Beautiful stock!

snake-eyes  :shake
Erin Go Bragh
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Offline gunmaker

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Re: A Niel Fields Flintlock
« Reply #5 on: October 15, 2014, 12:41:32 PM »
A beautiful piece--whatever it is.....What is the drop at nose & heal by the way....Really fine work.  Range report coming ?   ...Tom
Member#2184, 11-1-'12

Offline Hanshi

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Re: A Niel Fields Flintlock
« Reply #6 on: October 15, 2014, 02:52:09 PM »
No, it does not fit very well into the Lancaster architecture mode.  Many would lump it in with the "fantasy" rifles but that, too, makes little sense.  To my unschooled eye it appears to be the builder's own interpretation of a later flintlock with no particular destination in mind.  The rifle is so beautiful and appears so finely built that it would make no difference to me what it's suppose to represent.  Authentic?  Yes if you accept that many builders built what was ordered and didn't build them using cookie cutters like some "experts" seem to believe.
Young guys should hang out with old guys; old guys know stuff.

Offline RonC

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Re: A Niel Fields Flintlock
« Reply #7 on: October 15, 2014, 07:13:15 PM »
Hanshi,
You have stated my sentiments, as well.
I love to look at it and look forward to taking it to the range. I haven't yet become involved with the historical dress-up - no fringed leather or moccasins...yet. So, historical accuracy is not now my goal.
Ron

Offline Kermit

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Re: A Niel Fields Flintlock
« Reply #8 on: October 17, 2014, 11:11:17 AM »
Ron, it doesn't take fringed leather and moccasins to be HC, unless the period you want to portray is Disneyland circa 1960.

I don't have a problem with "fantasy" guns. I wonder if those Beans were criticized for not adhering to established gun architectures of Massachusets 1730 or Lancaster County 1780. Those Kentucky/Tennessee gunbuilders didn't show no respect!

Innovation happens. Otherwise we'd all be shooting bench copies of original pieces.
"Anything worth doing is worth doing slowly."
Mae West

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Offline RonC

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Re: A Niel Fields Flintlock
« Reply #9 on: October 17, 2014, 11:27:30 AM »
Thank you for those comments, Kermit!
Hey, I sort of like that Disneyland 1960 idea! After all, I did have a crush on Annette Funicello. One of the reasons I did not persist in Cowboy Action Shooting is that I felt uncomfortable dressed in the garb seen in Spaghetti Westerns B movies. However, Fess Parker Davey Crockett deer skin fringe...that's another story. :)
Ron

Offline RonC

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Re: A Niel Fields Flintlock
« Reply #10 on: October 17, 2014, 12:05:50 PM »
Target Results

This target was shot at 50 yards, 490 ball, .015 Ox-Yoke patches. I shot free-hand, but with my elbow resting on a shooting table.
The precision probably is more limited by my 67 year old eyes with developing cataracts.

Ron

Online RobD

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Re: A Niel Fields Flintlock
« Reply #11 on: October 23, 2014, 12:38:44 PM »
a beautiful rifle and some darned good shootin', congrats on both accounts, sir!

Offline RonC

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Re: A Niel Fields Flintlock
« Reply #12 on: October 23, 2014, 04:17:23 PM »
Thank you, rfd!
I can't remember having so much fun.
Ron

Online RobD

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Re: A Niel Fields Flintlock
« Reply #13 on: October 23, 2014, 04:29:37 PM »
i hear ya, sir!  i'm still having goodly fun with me tip curtis carolina "poor boy" ...


Offline Renegade

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Re: A Niel Fields Flintlock
« Reply #14 on: October 23, 2014, 06:55:15 PM »
Ron
She shoots as good as she looks! WOW, what a nice lookin rifle. :hairy
All Tyranny needs to gain a foot hold is for people of good conscience to remain silent.
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