Traditional Muzzleloading Association

Shooting Traditional Firearms and Weapons => General Interest => Topic started by: KHickam on April 09, 2012, 12:53:52 PM

Title: Smoothbore shooting left, not happy with group
Post by: KHickam on April 09, 2012, 12:53:52 PM
(http://www.hunt101.com/data/500/medium/Hides_and_targe_001.jpg)

I shot this target the other day - 50 yds offhand - 6 shots 75 grs FFg .18 ticking patch and .600 RB  - The gun is shooting left (could be my changing eyes) where before it was grouping right.  There are two holes in the 8 o clock position

Suggestions
Title: Re: Smoothbore shooting left, not happy with group
Post by: Adam Wetherington on April 09, 2012, 01:49:00 PM
Hold a little to the right.....LOL!
Title: Re: Smoothbore shooting left, not happy with group
Post by: sse on April 09, 2012, 02:14:20 PM
Not a smoothie guy here, but my first suggestion is to shoot several more groups to see what happens.
Title: Re: Smoothbore shooting left, not happy with group
Post by: mario on April 09, 2012, 05:08:53 PM
6 rounds in a ~5x5" group offhand?

My suggestion would be to be happy! :shock: It's not a rifle. Don't expect the same results.


But seriously, if you are checking for group, shoot off a rest, not offhand. It's the difference between "the gun is shooting left" and "you are shooting left."


Mario
Title: Re: Smoothbore shooting left, not happy with group
Post by: Longhunter on April 09, 2012, 07:23:16 PM
When I sight in my guns, I shoot from a rest, hold dead center or 6 0'clock and squeeeeze. The group you shot off hand is darn good I'd say. Play with your load a little. My 20ga's like 80gr. 2FFG.
Title: Re: Smoothbore shooting left, not happy with group
Post by: KHickam on April 09, 2012, 07:43:21 PM
Mario and Ron - Thanks - I know I should be shooting off a rest - but I have always shot from off hand position because that is likely the position I will be shooting from most
Title: Re: Smoothbore shooting left, not happy with group
Post by: pathfinder on April 09, 2012, 08:06:11 PM
True,it is the position we shoot from,offhand,but sighting and grouping in are 2 different thing's. Shoot from a rest till your satisfied with the group,where it's at isn't important...yet. Just make darn sure your sight picture is the same,Once grouped,then you can work on point of impact. If off the rest your all over the place,offhand you will not be able to determine what need's to be done.  Group first! Point of impact second.
Title: Re: Smoothbore shooting left, not happy with group
Post by: Riley/MN on April 09, 2012, 08:07:29 PM
Wind, glare, phase of the moon??? I'd throw a couple more groups downrange....
Title: Re: Smoothbore shooting left, not happy with group
Post by: SAWMA on April 10, 2012, 02:56:16 PM
I can get a nice tight group at 25 yds off a bench, but at 50 yds even off a bench my group is like your offhand! 100 yds and wow 18" between holes.
Title: Re: Smoothbore shooting left, not happy with group
Post by: pathfinder on April 10, 2012, 03:11:35 PM
50yds off the bench should be a little tighter that the group shown. Smoothbore's need to really "cook" to get decent accuracy. My .40 moothbore shoot's 1" groups at 50yd's.  Measures .405 at the muzzle,.400 round ball,pillow tick spit patch,65grs3f. My .50 smoothbore,.490 ball,pillow tick spit patch,110grs of 3f.
Title: Re: Smoothbore shooting left, not happy with group
Post by: Hanshi on April 10, 2012, 03:50:31 PM
Like SAWMA, 25 yards is great.  But out at 50 a paper plate group suits me just fine.  A deer won't know the difference.
Title: Re: Smoothbore shooting left, not happy with group
Post by: mario on April 10, 2012, 04:10:09 PM
Quote from: "KHickam"
Mario and Ron - Thanks - I know I should be shooting off a rest - but I have always shot from off hand position because that is likely the position I will be shooting from most

Problem being it adds more factors to what is supposed to be a controlled experiment. Sight-in/load dev. from bench. Practice offhand.

Mario
Title: Re: Smoothbore shooting left, not happy with group
Post by: Sir Michael on April 11, 2012, 06:54:03 PM
Quote from: "KHickam"
(http://www.hunt101.com/data/500/medium/Hides_and_targe_001.jpg)

I shot this target the other day - 50 yds offhand - 6 shots 75 grs FFg .18 ticking patch and .600 RB  - The gun is shooting left (could be my changing eyes) where before it was grouping right.  There are two holes in the 8 o clock position

Suggestions

Does your smoothbore have a rear sight?
Title: Re: Smoothbore shooting left, not happy with group
Post by: KHickam on April 11, 2012, 07:57:26 PM
Not when I shot that target
Title: Re: Smoothbore shooting left, not happy with group
Post by: Sir Michael on April 12, 2012, 09:44:04 PM
Until or if you put a rear sight on it you are doing pretty good you just need to set your rear aiming point of the breach a little more to the right.  You are fairly consistent just not using the right place.  Also the amount of front sight you are exposing seems to very shot to shot.  Fixing these two things will require some bench time where you can work on the sight picture until you know exactly what it should look like to hit a specific spot on the target.
Title: Re: Smoothbore shooting left, not happy with group
Post by: Longhunter on April 12, 2012, 10:57:46 PM
Smoothbores can be a finicky breed. It may take some time to fine what it likes. Size and amount of powder, size of ball, thickness of patch. I have one smoothie that shoots like a rifle out to fifty yards. The shadow of the tang screw is my rear sight. I just line it up with the front bead, not seeing any of the barrel and she shoots center. Guns like that are rare...I know because I've had a few smooth bores over the years.

I wouldn't put a rear sight on the gun. Be patient, and work with it, from what I see it looks like you've got a good one.
Title: Re: Smoothbore shooting left, not happy with group
Post by: snake eyes on April 13, 2012, 10:27:37 AM
Quote from: "sse"
Not a smoothie guy here, but my first suggestion is to shoot several more groups to see what happens.

I am with sse and mario What I see is very good shooting,off hand at 50yds with a S/B. I also would suggest a few rounds off the bench.You might learn if it is you or the S/B.
I would sure like to see the difference.....
John :shake
Title: Re: Smoothbore shooting left, not happy with group
Post by: Stormrider51 on April 15, 2012, 01:20:55 AM
I just have to put in another vote for bench resting the gun.  Offhand shooting is the supreme test of the shooter.  Shooting from the bench tells you what the gun is doing.  The idea is to solidly sand bag the gun under the forearm and at the butt so that you remove as much of the "you" as possible from the shot.  Snuggle into the buttstock and wiggle things around until the sight picture is dead on.  Take a couple of deep breaths and then blow out half of the third one.  Maintain the sight picture and squeeze the trigger slowly.  Let the shot happen.  I use the bench for load development and sighting in.  Only when I'm sure the gun is giving me the best it can do I work on my offhand.  Then if I'm shooting poorly I know it's me, not the gun.

John
Title: Re: Smoothbore shooting left, not happy with group
Post by: Longhunter on April 15, 2012, 08:30:56 AM
Quote
I just have to put in another vote for bench resting the gun. Offhand shooting is the supreme test of the shooter. Shooting from the bench tells you what the gun is doing. The idea is to solidly sand bag the gun under the forearm and at the butt so that you remove as much of the "you" as possible from the shot. Snuggle into the buttstock and wiggle things around until the sight picture is dead on. Take a couple of deep breaths and then blow out half of the third one. Maintain the sight picture and squeeze the trigger slowly. Let the shot happen. I use the bench for load development and sighting in. Only when I'm sure the gun is giving me the best it can do I work on my offhand. Then if I'm shooting poorly I know it's me, not the gun.

A good explanation John of a process that many of us take for granted but don't emphasize enough .  :bl th up
Title: Re: Smoothbore shooting left, not happy with group
Post by: pathfinder on April 15, 2012, 10:21:04 AM
Good to hear from you again John,and great explanation of the process needed to sight in a gun. Proof is in the .58 we traded back and forth,darn near 1 hole group's at 50yd's off the bench,1-1/2-2" off hand!
Title: Re: Smoothbore shooting left, not happy with group
Post by: Stormrider51 on April 15, 2012, 11:09:25 AM
Thanks, guys.  Been busy moving out of the city and into the country.  Got my honey bees in their new home, set up a chicken coop, and put in a Spring garden.  Haven't been online much.

John
Title: Re: Smoothbore shooting left, not happy with group
Post by: sse on April 15, 2012, 01:09:51 PM
Quote
set up a chicken coop, and put in a Spring garden
Great, give the chickens time to manufacture some fertilizer...!  LOL
Title: Re: Smoothbore shooting left, not happy with group
Post by: Longhunter on April 15, 2012, 04:18:02 PM
Quote
Thanks, guys. Been busy moving out of the city and into the country. Got my honey bees in their new home, set up a chicken coop, and put in a Spring garden. Haven't been online much.

Sounds like you've got a lot on your plate....or will have anyway when everything starts producing ....livin off the land...sure beats the citified way of life..  :rt th