Approximate value of CVA Kentucky Flintlock

[lefty41]

Have a friend that has one he wants to sell. It is at least 20-25 years old and from a kit. Won't see it until Monday, but is said to be in excellent condition. Would like some comments on what it's worth might be. I know the Kentucky model was their least costly kit. Central part of Ohio if location has any bearing on cost. Any help would be greatly appreciated. Read a lot on here but don't post much at all. just really getting started with Flintlocks, have one now that a friend built and it is a .36. Okay, enough rambling for now. Forgot to say, it is a .45
Thanks

[RobD]

to me, that cva ain't worth much more'n $100 and it'd have to be in both pristine form and function.  but i'd personally never buy it, or any other spanish made gun.

you really can't skimp on a flintlock rifle because it's all about the quality of the lock and the overall components and build.  and even then you need to learn the basics of making a flintlock work reliably.  that's not at all difficult or hard, it's about getting a Good Gun and Good Information.  there is good stuff to learn - components and processes.  if you haven't already checked it out, read this article before you buy - About Traditonal Muzzleloaders

for my money, and based on my trad ml experience, these dayze the most decent and reliable flintlock you can get for cheap are those built by the italian investarms company, rebranded as lyman, dixie gun works, cabelas, and others.  an unreliable flintlock gun will send you running back to those cap guns, pronto.  

so, i'm not saying yer friend's gun is bad in any way, but i am saying buyer beware and if you don't know what to look for and check out in a flintlock gun, get someone local who really does know to help ya out.

good luck !  

[Bigsmoke]

The 6th edition of the Bluebook of Modern Black Powder Arms lists the CVA Kentucky rifle at $210 for 100%, $180 for 98%, $120 for 90% and $75 for 80%.  Add $10 for flintlock.  The book was copyrighted 2009, so it is admittedly out of date.  Wonder when the last update to it was?  I don't know.
It was discontinued in 1996 and the last MSR was $280.00.  The book makes no differentiation between kit or factory rifle price wise.
Although it has always been considered kind of a cheap rifle, I have seen some of them that shot pretty well.  IIRC, there have been a lot of problems with the mainspring getting weak or breaking.
Hope that helps some.
Also, I am not aware of any difference between the CVA rifle and the Traditions rifle of the same model.  All made by Jukar.
John

[amm1851]

I had one of those in caplock once, and the buttstock on it was so thin it like to cut my shoulder every time I fired it. Possibly a slight exaggeration, but it wasn't comfortable for me to shoot. I find the Lyman products, the Deerstalker and Great Plains rifle, to be far superior. I think there is a Lyman GPR in flint for sale on the trade blanket here at a fair (more than fair, really) price. Update: Looks like that rifle has sold.

[James Kelly]

Have a new Traditions (guys who took over CVA in the USA) Kentucky flintlock .50 cal "with a blemish" coming from MidwayUSA this afternoon, $396 with shipping
Their flint locks do not have a good reputation. I'll try it, but likely buy a new L&R to fit from Track, about $150.
These guns have a lot of inauthentic styling details. But see the June 2011 post by Captchee on how he made a Silk Purse out of one.
viewtopic.php?f=9&t=15743&p=151526&hilit=Traditions+Captchee#p151526
I hope eventually to make mine into a Faux Leman.
I bought this rifle as I recall doing a metallurgical exam on an old CVA barrel, probably before your Dad had even thought about your Mom. Anyway it was nice, CLEAN low carbon steel. CLEAN = no sulfur additions to make the machining chips short & crumbly. Check out this video for how one survived miserable torture with smokeless (not don't try it, smokeless = fewer body parts) Skip the ad:
I used to look at these Spanish rifles with distain, for their styling, not such great locks, various other Squirrely Features. However I can fix most of these. It is about the only way I can get a rifle with a barrel of decent steel, other than buying Pedersoli.
No I do not want to talk about steel. See that Other longrifle site for more detail than you want to read or I wish to write again.

[James Kelly]

I think Lyman made by the same Spanish company, probably just as fine a barrel, I only happen to have info on the Traditions.

[RobD]

I think Lyman made by the same Spanish company, probably just as fine a barrel, I only happen to have info on the Traditions.

no no no no - as i posted above: lyman, dgw, cabelas and others are rebranded INVESTARMS italian guns that i think are far better than the spanish guns ... and i've had MANY of both the spanish and italian guns.  traditions is the cva of today, from the spanish jukar factory.

i'll say it again - IMHO the best value and quality in an offshore traditional muzzleloader are those guns from INVESTARMS.  pm or email me if you need to hear more.

[lefty41]

Thanks to everyone for your input. I will pass on this one and stay with "old sparky" as my only flintlock. It was custom built for me using a repurposed stock (from RH to LH) and a old barrel that is wonderful. Bought L&R manton lock and Davis trigger. It is a shooter and I am very fond of it. In .36 caliber, practiced with it but haven't used in a match as yet.

[Bigsmoke]

I think that is a pretty good decision, Lefty.  They are not a bad gun, but they aren't really a good gun, either.
Sparky sounds like a pretty good one to keep.
The little .36 is kinda puny when it comes to long range silhouettes, but for close in work, not bad.  Of course at Friendship, they have a special half scale silhouette range that is open to anything under .40 caliber.  Is fun.
Enjoy!!
John

[James Kelly]

Oops. My error, yes Investarms (Lyman) are indeed Italian.

Did just open my new flint Kentucky, Traditions. Still looking for what MidwayUSA calls a "blemish". Managed to put a small flint in the cock & it made a few sparks, threw them somewhere near the pan. Maybe put on an L&R next month, see how it goes.

It IS a new toy!

[RobD]

making a flint lock swap for an L&R may be desirable for the latest crop of spanish guns, but totally unnecessary for an investarms gun.

[Hanshi]

I received a cheap CVA kit built .50 quite some years ago.  The accuracy, frankly surprised me.  It was a percussion and took several deer for me; basically, it was a "beater" rifle.  Wasn't worth much but did its job very well.