Blowing down barrel

[Uncle Russ]

I have never personally seen a hot coal in a barrel, but it is easy to see smoke and hot gasses coming out the muzzle and the vent.  When I see that after a shot, I blow down the barrel.  If the gun did not go off, you would not see the smoke.

You should know your gun well enough to judge where the ramrod should be, loaded, unloaded, not seated, dry ball, and double charged.  Marks make it even easier.

I've kinda avoided posting to this thread because it sometimes brings out the beast in the safety conscience soul and makes others mad as Hell at the thought of being seen, or thought of, as idiots.
As far as blowing down the barrel...yep, I am one of those who do this, and I've been doing it for fifty years, or better.
I also use a blow-tube for my Sharps and Hi-Wall, to me it's purpose is the same....to soften the fouling.

I gotta agree with Pichou, Chuck B. RB, Capt. and several others here, regardless of what and how some individuals and organizations may view this subject.

Like many others, I also use "witness marks" on my Ram Rods. I also know when my rifle is "loaded, unloaded, not seated, dry balled, and double charged". I know this from where my rod is in relation to the barrel without even looking for the marks.

Anyone who has loaded and fired their Muzzleloader more than a dozen times should never be in doubt about whether it fired or not when they pulled the trigger....somehow I simply can not imagine this happening, but according to others it does.
Seems to me it either fires, or does not fire, either way there seems to be little doubt.

And, if in fact it did not fire, and someone was stupid enough to blow down the barrel.......Nuff said.

This is actually a great subject and those commenting are to be complimented on, not only their views and feeling on the subject, but the very gentlemanly way in which it has been discussed.

Uncle Russ...

[R.M.]

.....If the gun did not go off, you would not see the smoke..........

And if it was loaded, you wouldn't be able to blow out the vent, it would be plugged with powder and ball.

[Captchee]

Like you Russ , I find it very hard to believe someone would not know if their rifle went off or not
 In all my years  I cant ever  think of a time where  I didn’t know my rifle  went off , cap lock or flintlock .

 I don’t mark my RR . The reason for this is when I build a rifle , u   make an even rod . IE the rod is no longer the  bore length when empty. With the cleaning jag on , its ½ to ¾ above the  muzzle . For cleaning I recommend eather a cleaning rod , or a  necked jag .
 This way , if the end of the rod is above the bore at all , then something is in there ..
 Ill tell folks here something else I have witnessed  concerning Co2 dischargers .
 I have seen them blow  the patch and ball as well as most of the powder . But still leave enough powder to  make a sound report  when a cap is popped , pan fired or  an increased recoil when  loaded . How much powder is left down there But it seems at times ,  like it could be 10-15 grains

 As to hot  cinders .  I have  found them  blocking the flash hole . Picked it and then dumped out the cinder and found it  hot enough to burn the palm of my hand .
 I also have  during night shoots been able to see a glow  in the bore   through the flash hole , right after firing . Not always but enough times to know that  loading on top of it is not safe .
 A good heavy blow and then no glow ..
 The simple fact is we are not shooting center fires . Muzzleloaders have their own  issues that must be  dealt with . There is no doubt that they are firearms. Still however firearms with their own  issues that differ  from all others .

So if its un safe to blow   the bore  and there are proven cases of coals lighting off a charge while loading , then  rules need to be made  to ensure that EVERYONE runs a damp  patch after every round  fire .
Other wise , a club is  opening themselves up for the very same lawsuit . Maybe even a greater chance  because  a court is most likely going to  lean to shooter negligence  IF a case of death ever happens .
 But if a club does not  require  a wet patch in the safety briefing , while knowing of documented cases  of the charge going off  while loading , then im thinking they   would be more likely to be found neglant.
 Once an issue is  declared unsafe , then the base  reason for that  issue , MUST be addressed . Failure to do that   IMO  your open for a lawsuit

[rollingb]

I have but one serious question for the "NON-blowers",.... have you ever actually attempted to reload on top of a "hang-fire" because you (somehow) mistakenly "thought" your riflegun had discharged when you pulled the trigger?  :?  

Please be honest now,... because I'm really curious if such an incident has ever actually occured to anyone.

[Stryker]

I have but one serious question for the "NON-blowers",.... have you ever actually attempted to reload on top of a "hang-fire" because you (somehow) mistakenly "thought" your riflegun had discharged when you pulled the trigger?  :?  

Please be honest now,... because I'm really curious if such an incident has ever actually occured to anyone.

Nope, never have.

I've been shooting BP since 85 and do most everything everyone has mentioned here. My ramrod is marked, I use a pick, and I know when my rifle is loaded or unloaded. I simply don't put my mouth over a barrel. In my opinion it violates gun safety rule number 1; "never point your weapon at anything you don't intend to shoot.". It's personal preference for me, I don't berate guys I see doing it, but if they ask I don't condone it.

Captchee, I like the idea of that blow tube you mentioned earlier. I never thought of that. May have to stop at the hardware store and pick some tubing up tonight.

[pathfinder]

I have but one serious question for the "NON-blowers",.... have you ever actually attempted to reload on top of a "hang-fire" because you (somehow) mistakenly "thought" your riflegun had discharged when you pulled the trigger?  :?  

Please be honest now,... because I'm really curious if such an incident has ever actually occured to anyone.

Maybe it's just me, but I always hear a rush of air from the vent when loading,and I did see a guy on our walk-thru try to double load,could only get the ball barely started because of back pressure. We were able to safely get that other ball out without putting anything important over the muzzle, knock out as much powder as we could and let her rip. Impressive show, not at all recommended.

[Pichou]

I got a couple more thoughts...

Reenactors firing blanks in a "battle" might possibly have a missfire and not know it if they are in a military formation/volley fire.  The mil. loading drill does not allow for blowing, or dumping unfired powder on the ground.  Something to think about...

Next, matchlocks... you can put the glowing match in the pan and sometimes it will sit there and not set the prime off.  I bet it is the same with glowing coals in the bore, and there are a lot of non-blowers that don't know how close they are to a boom when reloading.

[Stryker]

I bet it is the same with glowing coals in the bore, and there are a lot of non-blowers that don't know how close they are to a boom when reloading.

In the almost 25 years I've been shooting, I've never had a charge go off. Even when praticing my quick reloads. I'm not saying it can't happen, but I think the dumping of the powder down the barrel, 99.99% of the time will smother any embers. It's kind of like mythbusters, how many times have those guys tried to ignite gasoline with a cigarette? The gas actually smothers the ember.

[Loyalist Dave]

The mil. loading drill does not allow for blowing, or dumping unfired powder on the ground

Actually, the proper drill does not, BUT a silly procedure has cropped up in Rev War reenactment that I believe is the reason for the recent burst barrel, which occurred last year.

The proper drill is that after firing in volley, the musket is lowered to the position of the beginning of the loading sequence.  Now..., you are supposed to look down to veryify smoke coming back through the touch hole to veryify the thing went off (especially if you have doubts).

IF your musket did not flash the pan, so all you had was a "clatch", you are supposed to half-cock your firelock, dump the prime, prick the vent hole, draw a new cartridge, prime the pan, close the frizzen, dump the remainder of the cartridge onto the ground, and be ready to follow the next set of firing commands.

IF your musket did flash, but you don't think she went off, you do the same thing.

In both cases you should feel the powder crunch when you prick the vent hole.

BUT, somewhere somebody introduced dumping of the main charge, and simply "reloading" the flintlock.  Which is, quite frankly, stupid, as it does nothing to address the failure to fire.  If there was no flash, either the prime is damp or you need to knap the flint.  If there was a flash, then you need to prick the vent hole to open it and to feel the powder.  IF you prick the vent hole and replace the prime (regardless of the problem) you are eliminating the two most common problems, and you are verifying the thing is loaded.  Reprime and attempt to fire.  IF you get two "clatch" in a row, knapp your flint, ensure the jaw scew is tight, then follow the above procedure.

If you don't feel the powder, it probably went off, and you were wrong.  What the dumping does, especially in humid weather, is coats the barrel with unfired powder..., and if this gets above the breech area, and in sufficient quantity..., you WILL bulge or blow your barrel.  I have seen some reenactors load, misfire, and dump as many as three times before they attempt to clear their piece.  

You don't "dump" your load unless there is a final cease fire, and you are going to be marched back to camp for cleaning, OR you are leaving the field for the rest of the action.

LD

[LRB]

"In the almost 25 years I've been shooting, I've never had a charge go off. Even when praticing my quick reloads. I'm not saying it can't happen, but I think the dumping of the powder down the barrel, 99.99% of the time will smother any embers. It's kind of like mythbusters, how many times have those guys tried to ignite gasoline with a cigarette? The gas actually smothers the ember."

 Odd that you bring that up. Knew an older guy that had a service station and repair shop in Orlando. He used gasoline to wash parts. One day the fire inspector comes in and reams him a new one over the open gasoline container. The old guy kinda told the inspector off, then said watch this. He tossed his cigarette into the gasoline. Said he had done that a few hundred times just to show people. Wanna guess what happened? After the fire was put out, the old guy got a violation citation, and never did that trick again. I don't believe you can smother a burning ember with black powder.

[Gambia]

I agree with Stryker but I wipe after every shot since I only shoot targets.A word of caution for all who don't think something can't happen,one way or the other let me introduce you to Mr Murphy and his Law (or is it Mrs Murphy?).

[pathfinder]

O'Tooles Law, "Murphy was an optimist"

[LRB]

I am intimate with both of those partys!!

[Riley/MN]

I am intimate with both of those partys!!

Yeah? You guys oughta try the life of Riley sometime...

[bluelake]

I agree with Stryker but I wipe after every shot since I only shoot targets.A word of caution for all who don't think something can't happen,one way or the other let me introduce you to Mr Murphy and his Law (or is it Mrs Murphy?).

A little OT, but I used to work with a lady who was the niece of the Murphy in question (used to joke with her about it once in a while).