commercail built smooth bores

[burch]

o.k. i`m in no position to afford a high dollar gun so who makes the best commercial built smooth bore. Of course i`d like a 20ga.  I have a CVA 12ga. double but just can`t seem to find the proper load and also i`d like a single barrel since it takes twice as much of everything to load my CVA.

                 Burch

[mario]

What's your $ limit?

A high dollar gun to you may be an average price gun to me.

Just for shooting/hunting? Re-enacting?

Mario

[burch]

well I could sell the CVA or maybe trade it. I`d need something for hunting and shooting. I`m not into re-enacting. OR  what about a smooth bore barrel for my Lyman GPR ?  is that possible ?

[mario]

OR  what about a smooth bore barrel for my Lyman GPR ?  is that possible ?

I don't know if it's an off the shelf option, but maybe.


Again, w/o and actual dollar figure, it's very difficult. Oh, are you looking for a flinter or caplock?

Mario

[cb]

Just about any of the barrel makers could make you a smooth bore to fit your GPT - Ed Rayle is one for sure......

[burch]

OR  what about a smooth bore barrel for my Lyman GPR ?  is that possible ?

I don't know if it's an off the shelf option, but maybe.


Again, w/o and actual dollar figure, it's very difficult. Oh, are you looking for a flinter or caplock?

Mario

  maybe a $500 range either flint or percussion. I wonder if a good flinter can be had at that price ? I kinda doubt it. Also, I wonder what kind of accuracy and range one can expect from a shorter barrel lenght like maybe 28" or 30". I`d like something fast handling. My 32cal. rifle has a 36"bbl and the GPR has a 32" bbl. Now both are good rifles but we`re talking about a shotgun now.

[burch]

I just checked out Jackie Brown`s web site and those guns have a reasonable price. What`s the difference between a fowling piece and a smooth bore rifle ?   Also, does anyone have experience with one of the 28" or 30" barreled guns ?

[Captchee]

As to  having a smooth bore fit to your GPR . Ya that’s doable  just like CB stated .
 However the stock configuration is less then desirable for wing shooting . If that’s the type of hunting your looking at doing .

 as to shorter barrels.
  My wife has a blanket gun with a 20 inch barrel . it’s a great little close range grouse gun . Its also not to bad at smoothbore distances  but she does her best at 25-50 yards . Past that shes still right in there .


 The difference between a fowler and smooth rifle is  basically ,that normally a smooth rifle  is a smooth bore  barrel set to a more rifle  designed stock . The barrel also normally has a rear sight . The hardware also is more  rifle then fowler

 Where a fowler is more to the lines of  what we call today a shotgun . IE its  is more in tuned to  wing shooting  over point or aim shooting .
 Thus they carry  most times carry a bigger  trigger guard loop , flatter but plate . The stock is cut  for a quicker pull ..

ou could also go with say a half stock  later fowler . that would work well with say a  barrel say 30 -34 inches long .
 would look nice to .
 
  500.00 isnt that much to spend  especially for a custom gun
 you need to be thinking about 2X that amount as 500 is just about the cost of parts  even for something like a NW trade gun . exspecialy if your thinking flintlock

 now sometimes i take  guns on trade for labor . Or part of the labor . Just depends on the gun , quality  and if I think I can turn the gun or guns over  to re coupe my labor cost in a build .
 i did that for Gobbler  here a couple years back  when i built his smooth rifle .
  i would be more then  happy to  discuss  with you  some pricing
and possible  options  to build you something either full custom or semi custom.

[jtwodogs]

:?

[mario]

  maybe a $500 range either flint or percussion. I wonder if a good flinter can be had at that price ? I kinda doubt it.

I don't know of anything in that range other than maybe a used T/C New Englander and they may be higher than that.

I`d like something fast handling. My 32cal. rifle has a 36"bbl and the GPR has a 32" bbl. Now both are good rifles but we`re talking about a shotgun now.

Length is only part of the handling equation. weight and balance are just as important. My 6lb., 48" barreled trade gun handles as fast as my modern 28" SxS 20ga.

Mario

[SAWMA]

I'd also just keep an eye out on your local internet sites selling guns, hunting equip., etc. by individuals. I was able to get an older TVM fowler in .62 that was in great shape with all the accessories for $600. Them i sold the items i didn't need separately for $200.

Some people just don't play on the forums and such, and have trouble selling when out of the muzzleloading circle. I've gotten great deals a couple times just being patient.

[Double Barrel]

Well Burch, if you don't strike up some kind of deal with a craftsman like Captchee to build a gun for you, you could look into building a kit on your own.  How handy are you with woodworking and metal finishing?  You can get into a pre-inletted kit with good hardware from any number of companies for under $600.

[Indiana]

I second Double Barrel's comments.  After getting into muzzleloading with a Cabela's Hawken rifle, I decided I wanted a nice flintlock rifle that wasn't a production gun anyone could buy like my Hawken was.  Problem was, I was in high school and couldn't afford anything like that.  I saved enough for the parts and built it myself!  It took a while to get done, I made some mistakes along the way, but at the end of the day I came out with a one of a kind rifle I built with my own hands.  Nothing can replace the kind of feeling you get from shooting a gun like that.

And I should say I did not have much in the way of wood or metal working skills when I started, but through practice and slow work I learned how to do it all so don't be discouraged if you think you don't have to skill to do it!

[Captchee]

Indiana
 well said.
 i would also add that after you build one . you will also understand why  those of us that do build alot , charge what we do .

 personally , i dont know how Jackie  charges as little as he does . he has to get a very big break on parts .
 the parts even for a simple  NW gun are  very close to 500, without a stock . add in a maple stock . even a pre carve  and your pushing 6 easily enough .

 inletting , drilling tapping , soldering  not to mention sanding , final sanding  and finishing  and do it for 150.00

 dont get me wrong , i think Jackie is a great fella . but there is no way i would work that cheep .

 now if a fella had a duplicator with tolerances unde.005 . that’s a complete different story .
 Prices are only going to go up fellas . Parts are getting mighty dear  these days

jtwodogs Posted: 8 33UTCp28 06    Post subject: .  

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
  :?

 i do take trade ins  JT . it just all depends on if i can get my labor out of them or have a use for the parts .
 2 years back , i bought  on  gun broker a brand new CVA sxs   still in the box for 225.00
  when i was able to finaly sell it , near a year later , i got 300.00 built  like it should have been  and still  new
 i have re built originals for folks on this forum for that same price when the parts were given to me .
 i dont take advantage of folks . all i ask is a fair price for my labor . you pay the  for the parts .
 Lets say you put 150 hours into  building a gun , whats your time worth ?
At 1.50 an hour that  NW trade guns is going to cost  900.00.
 If I wanted to get  minimum wage  . No more then the girl flipping burgers at McDonalds
 That same NW gun is going to run  over 1700.00

 I thought I could offer this person  a better selection to include a full custom for   a couple hundred more then Jackies prices , with his trade in . of which I offered 250.00  off of my labor.
 you want to see what i offered . no problem
 this is with using Davis or Chambers locks . Colerain  barrel at a  least . bras or iron hardware .

We have a flintlock as a base . But do you want it a full stock or a half stock .
For a half stock , how about something like this
Half stock English fowler . . I would put a full under rib on it . Thus it would IMO look very good . Exspecialy with a shorter barrel in the 30-36 inch range


For a full stock maybe something like A NW trade gun .
This gun has a very flat top to the comb and very simple flat plate hardware but I could round it and use hardware like on the half stock


For stock wood I could go either English walnut or maple .
With the maple I could go a medium figured stock with no problem
Or plain English walnut . English with figure will cost a little more depending on the cost of the wood .
Cost wise
For a NW gun I charge $1,000.00 semi custom , finished full stock with flat brass hardwear and flate iron trigger guard as shown in the photo

For the half stock English fowler $1,200.00, full custom to include checkering of the wrist and light engraving and pewter nose cap
under rib and such

Semi custom means that im building from a pre carved stock . As such I can only fit the gun to you concerning pull .
Full custom means that the gun is built from a blank . As such I have control over pull , drop , cast as well as much better control over the quality of wood .
Now quality doesn’t mean figure . It means hardness an weight .

Now if your sxs is what you say I could give you 250.00 off the above price
So you would be looking at
750.00 +shipping for the NW gun
950.00 for the ½ stock English

[burch]

Indiana
 well said.
 i would also add that after you build one . you will also understand why  those of us that do build alot , charge what we do .

 personally , i dont know how Jackie  charges as little as he does . he has to get a very big break on parts .
 the parts even for a simple  NW gun are  very close to 500, without a stock . add in a maple stock . even a pre carve  and your pushing 6 easily enough .

 inletting , drilling tapping , soldering  not to mention sanding , final sanding  and finishing  and do it for 150.00

 dont get me wrong , i think Jackie is a great fella . but there is no way i would work that cheep .

 now if a fella had a duplicator with tolerances unde.005 . that’s a complete different story .
 Prices are only going to go up fellas . Parts are getting mighty dear  these days

jtwodogs Posted: 8 33UTCp28 06    Post subject: .  

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
  :?

 i do take trade ins  JT . it just all depends on if i can get my labor out of them or have a use for the parts .
 2 years back , i bought  on  gun broker a brand new CVA sxs   still in the box for 225.00
  when i was able to finaly sell it , near a year later , i got 300.00 built  like it should have been  and still  new
 i have re built originals for folks on this forum for that same price when the parts were given to me .
 i dont take advantage of folks . all i ask is a fair price for my labor . you pay the  for the parts .
 Lets say you put 150 hours into  building a gun , whats your time worth ?
At 1.50 an hour that  NW trade guns is going to cost  900.00.
 If I wanted to get  minimum wage  . No more then the girl flipping burgers at McDonalds
 That same NW gun is going to run  over 1700.00

 I thought I could offer this person  a better selection to include a full custom for   a couple hundred more then Jackies prices , with his trade in . of which I offered 250.00  off of my labor.
 you want to see what i offered . no problem
 this is with using Davis or Chambers locks . Colerain  barrel at a  least . bras or iron hardware .

We have a flintlock as a base . But do you want it a full stock or a half stock .
For a half stock , how about something like this
Half stock English fowler . . I would put a full under rib on it . Thus it would IMO look very good . Exspecialy with a shorter barrel in the 30-36 inch range


For a full stock maybe something like A NW trade gun .
This gun has a very flat top to the comb and very simple flat plate hardware but I could round it and use hardware like on the half stock


For stock wood I could go either English walnut or maple .
With the maple I could go a medium figured stock with no problem
Or plain English walnut . English with figure will cost a little more depending on the cost of the wood .
Cost wise
For a NW gun I charge $1,000.00 semi custom , finished full stock with flat brass hardwear and flate iron trigger guard as shown in the photo

For the half stock English fowler $1,200.00, full custom to include checkering of the wrist and light engraving and pewter nose cap
under rib and such

Semi custom means that im building from a pre carved stock . As such I can only fit the gun to you concerning pull .
Full custom means that the gun is built from a blank . As such I have control over pull , drop , cast as well as much better control over the quality of wood .
Now quality doesn’t mean figure . It means hardness an weight .

Now if your sxs is what you say I could give you 250.00 off the above price
So you would be looking at
750.00 +shipping for the NW gun
950.00 for the ½ stock English

 I`m sure the price is more than fair Captchee. In fact if I we`re to opt on having one built i`d rather deal with you since i`ve been here for while and know your reputation. The guns you offered are beauties for sure. My only problem is coming up with the funds. That`s why I started this post asking for commercial guns because I just don`t think I can afford what your offering. Now, I could sell a couple of my other guns to fund the project but i`m not sure what i`d be willing to part with. I hope you don`t think i`m questioning your ability or think your prices are unfair because I don`t.  I`m just undecided on what i`m going to do for now.
        Burch