TC Patented Breech/Fire Channel View

[Idaholewis]

I decided to use this old Roached out .50 Cal Renegade barrel for educational purposes, I thought of sending it to Hoyt for a Rebore, Maybe Relined? But decided against it, This Barrel actually shot well, But had to many things going against it, it was drilled and Tapped for See Through scope mounts, 3-4” of the Bore down at the Breech end was in HORRIBLE condition. I completely stripped the barrel of it’s parts and used them on a REALLY nice old .54 Cal Renegade barrel i had tucked under the Bed. I didn’t buy this Rifle for the barrel (I suspected it would be junk) i bought it for the Stock and accessories for a Brand New Green Mountain LRH Barrel in .54 Cal (Affectionately known as my “White Wale” Barrel  Which i now have fitted in this Stock and ready for a test Run 

The Reason this old .50 Cal barrel shot decent is the riflings were good from the Crown, down about 20” or so, In other words The bullet had a NASTY 3-4” To get through upon Take off, and then the Riflings were good to the Crown. Cleaning this thing would have continued to be a Nightmare, Just not worth the Hassle

[Idaholewis]

 Enough of the Explanations as to why i did this, on with it 

Top view


Flipped over


Another view, This Particular Breech plug had the Clean out screw on the Side as you can see, and you can See through the nipple Hole here, The Fire Channel leads directly to, and under the Nipple


Now here is a View of my .50 Cal Cleaning Jag, as you can clearly see the Jag Stops on The Shoulders of the Breech plug, it can NOT get in the Patented breech just behind it.


TC makes a “Scraper” Tool for their Barrels, Here it is, as you can see it is Rounded and designed to fit in their Patented Breech


Here is the TC Patented Breech Tool inside the Patented Breech, again this is designed as a “Scraping” Tool, I rarely use mine, when you clean Properly it really isn’t necessary, But DEFINITELY doesn’t hurt to use it! After all TC designed it for their Rifles 

[Idaholewis]

By the pics above you can CLEARLY see what you are working with, It is ABSOLUTELY Vital that you Clean, and properly Care for this Critical Breech end! Here is the Root of 99% of Hangfires that occur in a Sidelock Muzzleloader with a Patented Breech! After i clean my Rifles, and oil them liberally, Oil gets in the Patented Breech and Fire Channel, All is Good, i want that oil in there when my Rifle is Sitting with a Folded Patch Between the Hammer and Nipple to Catch excess oil. When i get ready to Load a Rifle, i Pull the Nipple, Run a Few Dry patches down the Bore to Absorb Excess Oil, I then Point the Nozzle of my Air Compressor attachment Inside the Nipple hole with barrel pointed straight Down And i BLAST Compressed air through the Nipple Hole, As you can see by my photos above this Compressed Air is FORCING excess oil OUT of the Fire channel, I also Blow The nipple out really good as well. I then Run a Few more Dry patches, Then i Pop 1-2 Caps straight through with the Muzzle pointed down, i Run 1 more Dry Patch, And i am ready to Load my Rifle. Since i started the above method i have yet to have a Cold bore Hangfire, My rifles go off IMMEDIATELY 

[Idaholewis]

Hopefully this helps folks That don’t have a Clue what these things look like inside, The Ole Renegade Barrel Payed the Ultimate price for it 

When you clean these Sidelock barrels, Use a bucket of Tap Water, Dunk the Breech end in the Bucket, When you push a Patched jag down the Bore to the Breech Plug Shoulder “Stop” and Draw it Back out slowly it pulls Water back up in the Bore, i pull back about 12” or so and then RAPIDLY push the Rod back in til it Stops on the Breech Plug Shoulder, this “Rushes” Water back through the Patented Breech and Fire Channel, Do this several times. You don’t need any special tools to do the Job, just a proper Jag and Good fitting Patch. Some say A bore brush is not Necessary, But I personally like them, i use ONLY the good “Loop Through” Style brushes, Either Bronze, or Nylon. AVOID the press fitted brushes in a Sidelock, they are an accident waiting to happen, they can, and will Pull apart! It’s a bad feeling when you have a Brush Bottomed out in your barrel and you pull your cleaning rod back out to find the Brush is no longer attached to your Cleaning Rod :shock: I had it happen 1 time, luckily i was able to get it without much problem. If this ever happens, use a Copper tube that just fits inside the Bore, push it down and “Over” The brush, it will come Back inside the Tube. Avoid this problem by using a Loop Through brush in the First place 

Here is what i use, “Loop Through” When i feel the need to use a Brush, i use both the Bronze and Nylon, Notice how the Wire loops through the Ferrel end, These will NOT pull apart 


Another close up of a GOOD “Loop Through” Brush


This is a Press fitted brush, AVOID these in a Sidelock Muzzleloader! They can, and Will Pull apart!!




I shoot a TON, Therefore i go through LOTS of Patches, You can go to a Thrift store and get a Lifetime supply of Old Cotton T Shirts and cut them up in to Patches the Size/Sizes you need. I use a Piece of Plexi Glass and a Fabric cutter i got from Walmart that works like a Dream, i can cut up a BUNCH of Good patches in no time!

[Hank in WV]

Great post Lewis.

[Bigsmoke]

Thanks for your post.  I am sure it explained what a T/C breech looks like to someone who has never had one apart.  T/C used to sell breech plug wrenches so a person could take them apart, but for some unknown reason or another, quit selling them.  I never personally felt the need to unbreech one, but I am sure there are many who did.

Another way of cleaning out the patent breech of a T/C is to use a .36 caliber bore brush on the ramrod.  That will get into that passage pretty good.

Enjoyed your post on the 325 yard shooting.  I bet hauling that clanger up and down the hill worked up a bit of a glow.

Where abouts are you located up there?

John

[Idaholewis]

Where abouts are you located up there?

John

I live in Priest River, Are you Cda? I was just down there today, I walked around Blacksheep Sporting goods while the Wife was over at Costco, I have her let me off on the way by 

I do business with October Country, But Mostly Buffalo Arms. I am in BACO so often that it’s a 2nd Home to me 

[Ohio Joe]

With my TC Hawken, I always try to work a pipe cleaner in through the nipple hole, then use my small air compressor to blow out the barrel with my hand cupped over the muzzle with the nozzle in the bore - then run another pipe cleaner to make sure all is dried out... Never had an issue with the ol' TC Hawken. 

[Bigsmoke]

Louis,
Nope not CdA any longer, curse the fates.  Lived about 3 miles east of 95 on Ohio Match for many years, but had to relocate to CA.  It was a family matter.
I also had a place north on 57 at Gleason Mackabe road, about 3 miles east also.
At one time I owned October Country.  It's changed a bit since then.
Joe, I have heard a lot of people talk about using compressed air.  Never tried it.  My method was to wipe out the barrel with a dry patch, pop a few caps until I could see a reaction in the dirt, water, snow or whatever was convenient, then load and go for the gusto.  Never had misfires.  And for hunting, I always used musket caps.

[Idaholewis]

With my TC Hawken, I always try to work a pipe cleaner in through the nipple hole, then use my small air compressor to blow out the barrel with my hand cupped over the muzzle with the nozzle in the bore - then run another pipe cleaner to make sure all is dried out... Never had an issue with the ol' TC Hawken.

They will Run Trouble free as long as you pay attention to this Patented Breech, and Fire Channel area.

I mention the use of a little Hand held Steam Cleaner quite often. Below was From a used Rifle, New to me. I did my Normal Cleaning it in a Bucket of Tap water, This Rifle was like new, Bore was Perfect. It didn’t take no time and i was pulling Cotton White Patches. I decided to Go Through the Nipple Hole With Steam from my little Hand held Steam Cleaner, I wanted to see if I could get Anything else out of it? I was ABSOLUTELY sure i had it Clean, and Fact is i did have the Bore Clean 

Little Hand Held Steam Cleaner, this is an Old Picture, i was just Showing a way to effectively get Straight through the Nipple, i have since done away with the Tubing, No need for it


A Flush Nipple, A Piece of High heat Silicone Tubing, this Setup Worked REALLY REALLY well! But like I mentioned above i gave up on it, i get the same Results without messing with it, But this is Another option 


Here is what came from the Fire Channel, Patented Breech of the CLEAN Rifle i just spoke of above, This is what i got after a Deep Steam Cleaning. To say i was Shocked would be an understatement. This came from the Fire Channel, And Patented Breech, I had the Bore METICULOUSLY Clean. No wonder you hear of Hangfires, These things need Cleaned!

[Ohio Joe]

John (bigsmoke), Russ was just talking about using musket caps on his rifles in another post... I remember when that was quite common, even thought about converting mine as well - but never did... Yes, the cap drying out that port is another long time good method. I never used it myself after the cleaning process, but always capped a #11 off at the Range before loading to see (as you said - "see a reaction in the dirt") even though I went through my previous mentioned cleaning routine...

[Uncle Russ]

Lewis, with your permission, I am going to make this post a "sticky" for those who come behind us.

Rob and I have discussed this patent breech, and what it looks like on the gun, and in the barrel of the gun, and we at one time had a nice thread going on this same subject..
Since we both have Endoscopic cameras, with 60" cords, we can look into about any bore and take pictures to share with others on what's really down there
But we don't come close to your presentation, with your cutaway, for real educational purposes.

Great thread! 

Thank you, Sir

[Idaholewis]

Lewis, with your permission, I am going to make this post a "sticky" for those who come behind us.

Great thread! 

Thank you, Sir

Be an Honor!  My purpose in doing this was to help people understand these Patented Breeches, Detailed pictures can be easier than explanations with certain things, this being one of them. Rob is actually the Guy that made me aware of these Patented Breeches several years ago (thank you Rob!)

Here are a Few pics of a Breech Plug Pulled from a .58 Cal Green Mountain Drop in Barrel for the TC Renegade, and 54 Hawken (1” Barrel Channel) And Another TC

Green Mountain on the Right, TC On the Left.




Here you can see how much different the Green Mountain Breech Plug Ante Chamber/Powder Chamber is, Instead of a Shallow “Dish” Shape like the TC, The Green Mountain Powder Chambers are Bored Deep, and instead of a Long Fire Channel like the TC’s, The Green Mountain is a very Short, direct shot across from the Nipple in to the Powder Chamber. What some refer to as the “Cleanout” Screw, is actually how they Bored across to enter the Powder Chamber. The Green Mountain Breech Plugs are a MUCH Better design than TC’s in my opinion.
Look closely here at this Green Mountain .58 Cal 1” Breech Plug, in the very back on the left you can see where Cross Hole (Flash Channel under the Nipple) comes in to the Back of the Powder Chamber, Again, this is Bored across from the so called “Clean out” Screw on the Side.






 

[Idaholewis]

I own 2 Lyman Great Plains Barrels, i have never had a Lyman Breech Plug in my Hand to look at, But i am almost Certain they are like the Green Mountain Breech Plug Above, Am I Right on that Rob? I know you have some AWESOME Pics of Pulling the Breech Plugs of Lyman GP Rifles, and the Tools needed for the Job 

[Idaholewis]

One last thing on the Green Mountain Breech Plugs. Green Mountain made 1” and 15/16” Drop in Barrels, Calibers ranging from .32 Cal, Up to .58 Caliber

 All of The Green Mountain Breech Plugs i have seen look identical Exterior Wise, And the Powder Chambers are Bored the same, EXCEPT for Diameter of the Powder Chamber, on the Small Bores (.32 and .36) The Powder Chambers are Smaller in Diameter (Smaller Powder Charges, so there’s no Gap Between the Patched Ball and Powder Charge).

 I ran across this on a Fairly recent Barrel Build, i had a 1” .357 Fast Twist Long Range Muzzleloader Barrel Built, i had planned to use the 1” Green Mountain Breech Plug in the Photos above for that Build, That 1” Breech Plug was Pulled from a .58 Cal Green Mountain Barrel, And Since i needed a 1” Plug i was Sure it would work? NOPE! I found out QUICKLY that it wasn’t gonna Work! The Powder Chamber Diameter is MUCH larger on the .58 Cal Green Mountain Breech Plug. Had i of not Thought and installed it, My .36 Cal Patched Jag would have Slipped right inside the Powder Chamber, and of course gotten Stuck trying to Come back! I ended up going with a 1” TC Breech plug for that Build