Your TMA Officers and Board of Directors
Support the TMA! ~ Traditional Muzzleloaders ~ The TMA is here for YOU!
*** JOIN in on the TMA 2024 POSTAL MATCH *** it's FREE for ALL !

For TMA related products, please check out the new TMA Store !

The Flintlock Paper

*** Folk Firearms Collective Videos ***



Author Topic: Views on the 40 caliber  (Read 4820 times)

Offline Captchee

  • TMA Forum Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 6215
(No subject)
« Reply #75 on: December 08, 2009, 11:01:32 AM »
its not that the deer arent bigger then that . its that when you see a deer  and chose a spot on that deer  you should have no issue with hitting that spot

Offline mark davidson

  • TMA Forum Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 350
(No subject)
« Reply #76 on: December 08, 2009, 12:17:48 PM »
Cap, I know. I was just being humble. :-)  Imagine that! :-)  I just meant that there is a bit more margin of error for success on deer than there is on a playing card edgeways! I am shooting my gun well on the bench and from supported positions in the field. I am just not terribly confident off hand yet!

Offline followed by

  • TMA Forum Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 14
40 caliber
« Reply #77 on: December 21, 2009, 05:49:20 PM »
here in ohio i've used a .40 on 3 whitetails, all mature does, all under 60yds broadside with 50 grs. of 3f, .395 RB w/.010 patch. All 3 were complete pass throughs.  None ran over 70 yds before going down. Can't kill'um much deader than that!
NRA Life
NMLRA Life
Ohio State Trappers Life
Longhunter Measurer

Offline mike rumping

  • TMA Forum Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 517
    • http://www.rumpingproductions.com/
(No subject)
« Reply #78 on: December 22, 2009, 02:57:51 AM »
No doubt about it, it's hit placement that counts.   But I still like my bigger bore of .54 cal.
http://www.rumpingproductions.com/
TMA #226
Expires: 2/14/11
"Kentucke, situated on the fertile banks of the great Ohio,
rising from obscurity to shine with splendor, equal to any
other of the stars of the American hemisphere." ...... John Filson

Offline shademtman

  • TMA Forum Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 33
(No subject)
« Reply #79 on: December 22, 2009, 06:38:32 AM »
seems there is alot of thought here about .40 cal.....to be honest, i never owned one, although i am far from a newcomer when it comes to black powder.  I have noticed the round ball being compared to a modern centerfire bullet.....truth of the matter.... and ....fact is.... a bullet from say a 25-06 and a round ball from a muzzleloader are no where even close, i don't care what cal. ball it is.... the only accurate comparison between a modern projectile and a round ball would be if you had the same weight and same velocity... otherwise....your comparing apples to oranges.  The key here IS!!..... as mentioned already....RANGE....AND SHOT PLACEMENT.....sad but true, i find that traditional muzzleloading and traditional archery suffer from the same thing..... and that is.... to much ROMANCE and not enough practice!!!!!!!!!..... nothing wrong with being caught up in the romance of the sport, i am as much as anyone i suppose.... but i can also hit what i'm aiming at... someone on here questioned whether a head shot on a whitetail at 100 yards was an accident.... a reasonable question... truth is it happens way to often.... take your .40 know it's limitations....PRACTICE...PRACTICE....PRACTICE...!!!!  that can be said of any weapon.

Offline Loyalist Dave

  • TMA Forum Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 687
  • TMA Member: 800
  • Location: MD
(No subject)
« Reply #80 on: December 22, 2009, 07:30:05 AM »
Quote
the only accurate comparison between a modern projectile and a round ball would be if you had the same weight and same velocity

Well the weights are quite close between the 170 grain .30-30 and the 177-180 grain .490 round ball, as well as the heavier bullets available for the .35 Remington and the 225 grain .530 round ball.  The .357 magnum "works" with a light bullet for the .390 RB and with medium weight bullets for the .440 RB.  The specific cartridges are mentioned as they are often "familiar" to the modern shooter who is part of the conversation.  All the cartridges are factory loaded faster than the BP loads will perform in most barrels, but the reloading data shows the bullet weights and velocities do cross when hand loading.  Many of the .357 factory loads from rifles with 20" barrels actually are under velocity when compared to the .390 or .440 BP loads.    (Usually the person who is not well versed with BP is asked if they would consider hunting deer at 100 yards or less with a .30-30, a .35 Remington, or even a .357 Magnum in a lever-gun..., and the conversation continues from there.)

AND as was pointed out..., it is a crude comparison, and done for those not well versed in BP performance.  For, as is well known, even when using all lead bullets, the cartridge bullets are harder and have thinner cross sections so penetrate better but mushroom or deform less.  Still there have been those who on other forums or other threads have wondered about the .530 RB as it's very close to the projectile weight and diameter of a .45 ACP.  I use it as a way of getting the ill informed to understand that there is much more to it than caliber.

And shot placement is the key to both black powder as well as cartridge guns.

LD
It's not what you think you know; it's what you can prove.

Offline Captchee

  • TMA Forum Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 6215
(No subject)
« Reply #81 on: December 22, 2009, 07:36:49 AM »
thank you dave , you said it better so i deleted my post  :shake

Offline Loyalist Dave

  • TMA Forum Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 687
  • TMA Member: 800
  • Location: MD
(No subject)
« Reply #82 on: December 22, 2009, 07:44:43 AM »
Thank you for the compliment sir, and you are up early no?   My real time is 2 hours late than the server time as posted  :)

When I hit the Power Ball I will set up a private lab, and pull in some physics and ballistic guys from U of MD and maybe Goddart Space Flight Center in Greenbelt MD, and really get into RB's as they were abandonded when cartridges came along right at the same time scientific research started to get useful.

LD
It's not what you think you know; it's what you can prove.

Offline Captchee

  • TMA Forum Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 6215
(No subject)
« Reply #83 on: December 22, 2009, 07:59:33 AM »
yep im up early , got some things to do .
 never ending lol .